Built using an ORF surplus parts kit on a Stamped Century CETME Receiver, papered as a pistol. Cost $550 including the retractable stock ($140 Centerfire - for when the LEGAL registered sear pack is installed) Made a pistol butt-plate using 1/4" steel on back of the cap for use as a legal pistol when the sear pack is out. Barrel turned to 8.75"
Here's a pic of my home-made clone with the REAL Vollmer
Before anyone gets their panties in a bunch, the pins on the lower are fake; it's clipped and law-abiding
The HOOPS we have to jump through -
Flash
Flame is as long as she is tall......
It's a "warped still shot" taken from a froze video
Was my first HK type build and easier than I would have thought, though I had some helpful coaching. Paddle Mag release was the trickiest part (6+ hrs using a dremmel), converting the surplus G4 pack to semi was a breeze. Works 100% with original locking piece firing Wolf Ammo http://media.putfile.com/HK51-Clone-with-Fleming-Sear
Shooting cheap Indian Surplus (yes I know) requires the #18 locking piece for the reduced pressure, and also runs 100%. So if I stick with Wolf, I can use the locking piece in the up-coming 51K build. At least that's the plan....
Do you have an exploded pic of all the parts? How long is tube on the carrier once you shortened it? Does your cocking tube extend into the receiver like th original 91 or is it shortened also?
Thanks for answering my questions. Maybe I should do a tutorial as I go.
Your first '51 or a 51K won't be a 'casual build' or everybody'd have one. 20 hrs of reading = 10 hrs of building.
The barrel & cocking tube length is determined by which handguard you'll use. MP5 HG = 51. MP5K/SP89 = 51K. It's one or the other, unless you're building your own handguards
Here are some pics that should help - 51 is on top, 51K on the bottom / BC's too. 51K BC is longer (though the gun is shorter) because I got far more involved in slowing the ROF. Heavier = slower. This is not like a Mac. Unless you're running a sear pack for F/A, go short on the BC, longer on the cocking piece, and make it easier to build, and cock. I have two different length BC's & CP's for the 51K; the sum length of each pair is the same, but the ROF varies quite a bit. Being a decent welder helps - being EXCEPTIONAL with a dremmel is mandatory
This is the most important pic - study cocking piece lengths by looking closely, in the slot. Save to file then ZOOM IN
The longer BC is for the shorter weapon. Your measurements WILL vary. Important thing is that it UNLOCKS the bolt easily
51K will need an interlocking lip between the CP & BC, so the CP remains aligned, and doesn't 'flip out' of the ejection port when cocked (here's my first attempt, before making the longer BC)
If this can be done with CETME kits, are you using the same locking piece or a modified one?
Anyone else still looking into this? I really want to make this work. Just not sure what I need to do it.
I've read most of the threads on this but can't find any on using a CETME as a base. Are you planning to use an HK bolt, carrier, and trunnion or use the CETME parts? I hear the lock up time needs to be shortened due to the shorter barrel (i.e. lose of back preasure for blowback operation), so how to do this with CETME bolt & carrier if there is only one locking piece for CETME?
That's a good question. I haven't tried anything with the CETME kits yet. HK/G3 LP's are not compatible with CETME boltheads, according to this page: Cetme Parts!
A 51 built on a g3 kit can use a standard G3 LP with strong ammo (Wolf works, but not weak surplus) but a "K" will need a #18 LP to function. We need a sharp machinist to figure out how to re-grind the (shoulders on) CETME LP's to cycle a 51K - profit may be involved for someone willing to provide that service
Just left a message to some guys who may have a HK#18 LP or at least know where to get one. From there I'll see what the angle differences are and if we can modify the cetme LP to match the HK profile. Who knows? I'm sure someone else out there has at least attempted the same thing.
I have an extra #18 LP. It cost me $104 from Gordon Miller.
If anyone wants to put a REFUNDABLE deposit on it while attempting to duplicate the shoulder, let me know. I am not pushing to sell - just a refundable deposit so I don't lose it. Panaceabeachbum borrowed it for that very purpose a while back, but found the shoulder difference is so slight that he got his to work (G3 parts) without duplicating it. I might add his has a 4.5" barrel!!!!!
So maybe a good polishing could help instead of actually grinding on the LP being that it is a hardened piece? If the standard LP can work in a 51, it may work in a CETME...maybe.
You know that's a good idea. I spoke with Panaceabeachbum today - he inspected that #18 locking piece beneath a 140x magnifier, and didn't see any signifigant difference between it and a regular G3 one
A deep polishing just may do it, maybe repeated steps to check for differences as you go. Could be done on-site during testfires, with a dremmel & compound. If you go that route, would you post your results?
Thanks
Steve in El Paso
PS I take an inexpensive AC inverter along for testfires, to run a dremmel from the cigarette lighter in my Jeep. It's eliminated making an extra trip back home, many times. Well, at $3.30 a gallon?!?
Steve revisiting my CETME pistol project and went searching for your video's and discovered they were gone. Have you put them up elsewhere? I am going to do the 51 build and not the K. Shot a Vector today and was impressed by the pressure wave, but disappointed that the back cap was bending on the owner. He said he has already sent it in twice for repairs. Any holy grail suggestions for the recoil spring assembly? I notice that the vector has a telescoping affair.
Vids were hosted by Putfile. Not a reliable server - they drop out when not accessed regularly, or when flagged as "violent & disturbing content". Now who would do that??
Starting with a 51 is a wise decision. K is trickier; same principles but more serious compacting. Parts kit's aren't as affordable now, so best to build what you know will work.
Can you be REAL SPECIFIC on what area of the end cap (on that Vector) is bending? Does it have a rubber buffer? (mine do) If I'm not mistaken, they have two-pin back caps. Is Vector still doing warranty work? Rex Merril showed me their telescopic-guide at KCR several years back. Neat approach, but both can be done without it.
I only shoot mine about 3 times a year now, due to current .308 prices. Usually only when friends are visiting. Everyone always likes shooting them. Recoil is suprisingly mild when shot from the hip
Steve,
If you have the video files still you can post them in our gallery. We support most video formats. I Would really like to see them myself. If you need help PM me.
I have a spare G3 receiver and parts kit and I would love to build one of these (SA of course).
I've read through the threads and your links, do you have any exact lengths for the cocking tube, BC, etc for a 51 build?
With kits as much as they are these days I would hate to make a mistake that ended up costing me time and more money...
Here are some build notes I have gathered from the net. THank you to those that posted them. This is the dimensions from a gentleman at hkpro.com. Steve, Please chime in with your thoughts on these. Thanks!
I'm in the process of building a 51k and I could use a couple of G3 or CETME barrel stubs around 6 inches or so.Does anyone have any left over from cut barrel kits?If so let me know how much you are asking.Thanks
what would be a good length for the 51K carrier and, cocking tube? Also, on the early style G3 cocking tubes, do you still need a hanger? Thanks for all the great help!
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Related Threads
?
?
?
?
?
Gunco Forums
772.5K posts
34K members
Since 2004
A forum community dedicated to AK-47 and AR-15 firearm owners and enthusiasts. Come join the discussion about optics, hunting, gunsmithing, styles, reviews, accessories, classifieds, and more!