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Thread: 308 ak

  1. #221
    Gunco Member us_dragunov's Avatar
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    Well...I happen to talk to some of their designers and specifically mentioned this to them on a side note and they were very quick to correct me that the pressures were fine and that the reason they added that extra lug was to try and squeeze a little more accuracy out of the .308. I'll find out more on my next visit with them, but until I can see the actual "publication" and from what source...which I will ask them about and have them verify...I am going to remain skeptical. I have seen a few .308 builds that do just fine on hot handloads without a third lug. How many does the M76, PSL, .308 M90s have???

  2. #222
    No Hope For Me 1biggun's Avatar
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    flat out ask them how much pressure a AK trunion is rated for or will proof test at. It would be the first thing Id ask if i ever met someone in the know

  3. #223
    Gunco Regular allesennogwat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by us_dragunov View Post
    Well...I happen to talk to some of their designers and specifically mentioned this to them on a side note and they were very quick to correct me that the pressures were fine and that the reason they added that extra lug was to try and squeeze a little more accuracy out of the .308. I'll find out more on my next visit with them, but until I can see the actual "publication" and from what source...which I will ask them about and have them verify...I am going to remain skeptical. I have seen a few .308 builds that do just fine on hot handloads without a third lug. How many does the M76, PSL, .308 M90s have???
    Those two lug models have heavy bolts. One of the design features of the AK is the bolt to bolt carrier weight ratio. Increasing the bolt weight with the same bolt carrier weight in theory would reduce reliability. The three lugs can't have anything to do with accuracy. The reason some bolt actions have three lugs is to reduce the size of the lugs so the bolt doesn't have to rotated as far as a two lug bolt with larger lugs. The increase in lugs in the AK is to handle more bolt trust from the larger cartridge.

    During the designing of the Beretta AR70 and Sig 540, both Beretta and Sig teamed up at first to design one rifle. The design team included two American engineers. The Americans wanted a multi lug bolt like the M16 because they claimed it was more reliable in design because the bolt didn't have to rotate as much as having larger bolt lugs. Both Sig and Beretta rejected the multi lug bolt design because they claimed it would hurt accuracy by not being able to always get even loads on all of the bolt lugs. They both went went to two lug bolts for "accuracy", because they felt even lug contact was possible with two bolt lugs. I would have rejected the mutli lug bolt due to not always being able to have even bolt lug contact, but my reason would be the strength would be weaker with higher bolt lug loads on less then all bolt lugs.

  4. #224
    No Hope For Me 1biggun's Avatar
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    xxx
    Last edited by 1biggun; 03-06-2016 at 10:50 PM.

  5. #225
    Gunco Member us_dragunov's Avatar
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    Well stay tuned guys...as I may be able to get a monthly or weekly Q&A post type of deal with some of THE guys...you guys could post a question or two that I take to them and then I come back and post their responses. They might think it as fun too. We'll start with the .308 bolt and WHY it has a third lug and HOW MUCH pressure can it and the trunnion take. I'll start a new thread and post this question and their answer after I talk with them. Sound good?

  6. #226
    No Hope For Me 1biggun's Avatar
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    xxx
    Last edited by 1biggun; 03-06-2016 at 10:51 PM.

  7. #227
    Gunco Member us_dragunov's Avatar
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    It shouldn't be too hard to setup. I think they will find it fun and interesting too. We'll see what they say though and if they are in I'll make it happen. By the way I think the average worker there makes about $500 per month.

  8. #228
    No Hope For Me 1biggun's Avatar
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    Its a shame there is no way to export Sagia or Vepr 3 lug bolts out of there. Is there any way to buy those parts seperatly over there????

  9. #229
    No Hope For Me 1biggun's Avatar
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    xxx
    Last edited by 1biggun; 03-06-2016 at 10:51 PM.

  10. #230
    Gunco Regular allesennogwat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1biggun View Post
    Its a shame there is no way to export Sagia or Vepr 3 lug bolts out of there. Is there any way to buy those parts seperatly over there????
    One problem is in most of Europe and other countries any gun part "exposed" to chamber pressure is controlled. The other problem would be selling parts that effect headspace usually aren't sold by commercial gun makers.

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