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Thread: 308 ak

  1. #271
    No Hope For Me 1biggun's Avatar
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    I can do sometesting on a bolt and trunuon but it will be awhile before i get to it. I need to really get my shop in better order so that this hobby is not a s much of a chore and more fun. Im going to have a 243 up and runing very soon how ever and it will be a screw build so I suspose I could swap in your spare trunion with some sort of a barrel on it to test pressures. one of those sarco barrels would be good for that or for that matter a 308 barrel would work its not like im likely to hurt the barrel and if I did so what.

    the tricky part would be estimating the pressures and what were really testing. It would be nice if there were poroof loads you could just buy. Or if there was some published data that had those loads listed. maybe some one with the load from a disk can help there. i will need to round up a chrony as well that way i can verify the speeds. if the speeds are high and the primmers are flat and the cases are starting to stick Im guessing ( only guessing ) that we would be in the 68,000 + range. a 22-250 can run as high as 65,000 PSI with out flat primers or other issues so it would be a start.


    Id be happy if I could run 52,000 PSI with any of the 308 family of rounds as that is the middle of the road for most of them. and those pressure will perform very well in at those pressures. in fact id be surprised if maony factory commercial loads were close to that number. I cant even get close to many of the max loads in my lyman book with out flatening or blowing primers so why worry abut it? 52,000 is pleanty or even 50,000 PSI for that matter. hell the 300 savage with only 45,000 PSI will move a 130 grain bullet at about 2850 FPS . that is around 400 FPS faster than the x39 with a slightly lighter bullet. AT 50,000 PSI ( above 300 sav Sammi specs) it will give well over 3000 FPS. give that round 50,000 psi with a 150 grain pill and your going to do close 2800 or so. that is pleanty for any thing that walks around in north america

    If you wantto send me a bolt and trunion ill load it till some thing moves or blows and report back.

  2. #272
    Gunco Veteran jreifsch80's Avatar
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    Ok yeah it doesn't matter what we proof it with just to get an idea where it will start failing in fact maybe we could even use a press to load a locked bolt in a trunnion to even simulate bolt thrust might be as good as loading a proof load with limited equepment. Which I could do that on my buddies press that has a pressure gauge that also shows how pounds or tons are being applied with the press if the bolt and trunnion can handle 5 tons (10,000 lbs) then I think that would be a great sign especially since a round being fired is maybe less than a second while a press is continuous though I wouldn't necesarily leave it loaded too increadibly long. Does that sound like it would be a good test?

    By the way what kind of pressure do factory load .243's run? I would love a .243 like you're doing but I'm not sure I want any rifle that can only eat hand loads.

    I have been thinking about wildcats for a while like say a 6x57 but loaded to match .243 performance with the larger case capacity it might keep pressure lower what do you think?

  3. #273
    Gunco Regular smartbomb's Avatar
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    biggun did you get a chance to run the thrust web page i posted saturday? if it works well enough i will start to add the flex and lug sheer calculations. i agree that real world test are good practice. the down side is having the hardware and a rigorous method. comparisons with raw data are a first start way to narrow the field.
    al gore is full of carbon enriched shit

  4. #274
    No Hope For Me 1biggun's Avatar
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    I was unabe to get the page to do any thing once opened Im not sure why. Ill try again tommorrow if I get a chance on a differant computer.

  5. #275
    No Hope For Me 1biggun's Avatar
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    I have been thinking about wildcats for a while like say a 6x57 but loaded to match .243 performance with the larger case capacity it might keep pressure lower what do you think?
    take a look at the 6mm AR turbo it comes damm close to 243 performance and in a AK/AR length mag.

    If your going to play the conversion game with a 243 or 308 IMOO reloading is a good idea. some of the factroy loads could be really hot. the SAMMI on them is up there and a factory load can be loaded to that spec. jusging buy what winchester showes for loads in there books using the two powders thay make. there are a few compressed loads that are listed as max that are well under the SAMMI specs. UNless winchester uses a diffferant powder than what they sell it would be hard for them to make it any hotter when You cant get any more powder in the case.

    If you going to try to feed a Auto loader for any thing more than hunting and only shot it a few times a year IMOO you would be a fool not to reload. there is no military surpluss 243 so unless your looking a a 7.62 nato/308 then it is all way to expensive for plinking or blasting so Id spend a little money on a press and use that reusable brass and load it to a safe load for less $$$$$$. you cna always have a reloader do it for you for a fee if you dont reload there are a few companys who can do custom ammo per customers specs.

  6. #276
    Gunco Veteran jreifsch80's Avatar
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    Thanks for the advice bg I was saying I don't want a rifle that only eats handloads as in that I can buy factory ammo at times but you're right, I'd be a fool not to reload if I were to take a .243 out to shoot. when I go shooting I usually go through at least 100 rounds an outing on my m76 same with my mauser and my x39's I'm in a hurry if I only go through 100 rounds an outing. I'll look up the 6mm turbo. I noticed in midway's catalog they have pilot drilled reloading die blanks for reasonable. Makes me think even more about some idea I've had a while, a .308 case shortened to around 40mm oal with a sharp shoulder and almost no body taper necked down to 6mm or 6.5mm (though that might be one of these 6mm turbos already or something like that)

    One question I keep forgeting to ask, how do rebated rimmed cases feed from a mag? Did you have any problems with them or is it such little difference that its a non issue?

  7. #277
    Gunco Regular smartbomb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1biggun View Post
    I was unabe to get the page to do any thing once opened Im not sure why. Ill try again tommorrow if I get a chance on a differant computer.
    try this. i uploaded the file to my wifes domain.

    http://www.tallycoupondiva.com/BOLTTHRUST3.html

    it should run in your browser
    al gore is full of carbon enriched shit

  8. #278
    No Hope For Me 1biggun's Avatar
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    I have not rebated any yet but it will happen.

    a 6mm or 6.5mm bench rest is close to what your talking about and you can buy dies and reamers al over the place.

    there is a thread I started a few monthes a go on the ar turbo. its a grendal case blown out some. it looks like a really good round for the AK if yiu want to keep the mag length the same. IMOO if your going to build a gunfrom scratch just build it to take a 308 win lenght case, this is not a AR so why be confined to a unessacary short mag well????

  9. #279
    Gunco Regular smartbomb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jreifsch80 View Post
    I've always wanted to adapt isreali hb hgs for an ak it looks even better than I imagined, I should get a set for my m76
    centerfire has the hgs for 14 bucks. that why i decided to give it a shot.
    al gore is full of carbon enriched shit

  10. #280
    Gunco Veteran jreifsch80's Avatar
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    Ah they still have them! Lol I think I'll order a set tomorrow also I put a m72 receiver on the back burner though I relieved the front trunnion to take g3 mags and enlarged the magwell though I have to clean the sides of the mag on the belt sander but that's cake with those alloy mags what I originally thought was a standard length bolt and carrier .308 build I think I'll finish it and do a lot of remote testing with 7.62 nato. I'm thinking of using a cheap used apex fal barrel then maybe I should use a fal gas system and handguards look at what your simple picture of isreali hg's on your ak are making me think about lol also bg your .243 build made me go the g3 mag route but that's not a bad thing you're right those shorter cases are best for me to save for an ar build so I'm not too tempted to build an ar10 and really make myself broke haha

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