Hmm... That sounds like it would be tough to do. 45 Winchester Magnum is powerful enough that it's going to need a locked action. Trying to feed a pistol-type cartridge through the AK action will be a real trick. That's not to say that it's impossible or anything, but I think it would require a single-feed magazine, possible narrowing of the feed lug on the bolt to clear the magazine feed lips, and the feed ramp would probably have to be removed from the trunnion to ensure enough clearance for reliable feeding. The mouth of the chamber will probably need a generous taper to accept the round reliably.
Double-feed magazines might work, but would have to be very carefully placed to allow for reliable feeding. Too close and the guide/locking lugs on the trunnion will deflect the front of the round too much to get to the chamber. Too far and the bullet will be free of the magazine before it begins entering the chamber. Getting a fat, stubby bullet to guide into the chamber is much trickier than guiding a long, slender bullet to do the same thing. A single-feed magazine would solve the problem of deflecting the round to the left or right during feeding, since a single-feed magazine by its very nature would have the round centered.
For the ak I think I will just use grizzly mags since I will have the pistol with me when hunting. Def going to need to retain the rotating bolt. I know from past projects that 30 carbine mags will work
my thought is rotating bolt gas operated semi. I dont think feeding from a single stack grizzly or wildey mag is gonna be any problem, pretty much a straight shot into the chamber with the grizzly mag. I am pretty sure the ak bolt can be opened up enough, I have seen an ak in .458x2 with the bolt face opened up larger than needed for the winmag , it was throwing 500gr fmj at 1000 fps
Why would the action need to be locked? Not following... seems like it would be less powerful than that Tromix .458 build, but in a smaller cartridge? If he can build that in Semi config, then why not this one? How long of a barrel would you do?
Why would the action need to be locked? Not following... seems like it would be less powerful than that Tromix .458 build, but in a smaller cartridge? If he can build that in Semi config, then why not this one? How long of a barrel would you do?
I think what he is reffering to by locked is via the standard rotating bolt verses the staright blowback system used in the 9mm and 45 ak builds, locked at moment of firing via the rotating bolt, unlocked when the gas piston moves the carrier rearward. The std ak is considered a locked breach firearm, uzi unlocked
I am planning on it bieng a semi auto gas operated rifle just like the std ak with rotating bolt , I am not familiar with the 458 tromex but at 1200 ft lbs of energy out of my pistol the 45 winmag is just to stout to be a straight blowback so tech it will be a locked breach via rotating bolt.
My reason for using the 45 winmag in this build is I already have an AR15, rebareled deerfield carbine and m1 carbine in the caliber as well as an lar grizzly pistol and wildey hunter in 45 winmag also. Once you slam 230 gr fmj out of a rifle at 1700 fps it gets adictive. The 45 winmag can safely be handloaded to far exceed the 44 magnum and Since I already have dies brass etc it seems like a natural choice (for me). I would work with the 50 beowolf but both my alexander ARs had cracked lowers and one the upper as well as multiple cracked bolts so I think it might be a little to much but maybe the ak action could handle it, lack of bullet choices also kicks the 50 beo out of the running.
Please post a link or more info to the .458 tromex as I might give it some consideration, If it uses .458 diam bullets so I could use the 500gr fmj if brass is easily formed that might be exciting, never have to many big bores
OK that makes more sense now. Personally I would consider the AK action much stronger than the AR, so even if they are cracking things on an AR, I wouldn't worry about an AK. But that's IMO. Meeper converted one to .50 Beowulf before.
Look at the other links in this section for additional .458 info... bunch of .458 caliber options it would seem. It was 1biggun that was looking into it...
a little bigger than the 45 win mag to say the least. I may have a reamer source but need to keep quiet on it for now as the 458 socom is a propierty round and I dont want to rock the boat. I plan on rechambering a barrel for it. see the posts under 458 Socom reamer quests hit a snag. One of the ammo/ brass manufactures stated that this is technicaly a pistol round and that the pressures were low. as you said bullet selection is the big + for this over the beowulf. this will be a AK hunting pistol from hell 450-500 grain bullets.
I remeber the guy refering to it as a 458 alaskin, he had a little remington mountain rifle in the same caliber I have a couple of rounds and its just 458 winmag with a case length of exactly 2". The cases still have the magnum belt and large rim diameter ,not the best choice for an ak bolt, but the gun did run very well. Wouldnt be that hard to turn the belt away and rebate the rim like the beowolf, with a little patience it might be possible to grind a lathe tool to do the whole mod in one plunge. Like all this stuff the $200 reamer and custom dies are the drawback, but I sure like the idea of lobbing those big 500 gr fmj or barnes solids
How about if you get some sulfur, or use that Brownells stuff, and make a casting of the .458 SOCOM chamber. THEN, adjust a few measurements (neck location perhaps?) so as not to infringe on their patent, and presto you have a .458 BIGGUN chamber - email the measurements to Clymer, and have a reamer set made.
I am looking at several rounds as possable candiates. several companys said they can work with me to do a SOCOM like round. I liked the 458 SOCOM because the bolt dia would not need to be changed. the 223 WSSM Brass may be reworkable http://www.rifleshootermag.com/ammunition/super_short_mag/
the 243 leviathan appears to be based off of this round http://accuracysystemsinc.com/ar15_conversion.html
I am ordering a book on wildcating to learn what can and can't be done as far as forming brass. I am going to try to cut some flutes in a straight rod just to see how hard it is, may look into doing the whole reamer building my self. Hell if they could do this stuff back in the 1890's with what they had for equipment I should be able to do it with all the lathes and mills in my shop. are there any good web sites on wildcating ammo??
not sure if its still listed in the brownells catalog or not but the book Barrels and Actions by Harold Hoffman, 1991, has quite a bit of info on reamer making, barrel drilling, rifling etc, takes all the mystery out of chamber reamers
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