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Thread: My 45-70 barrel arrived...

  1. #11
    No Hope For Me 1biggun's Avatar
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    I'm going to use a "fish gill" style compensator - think Barrett .50 - that pulls the gun away from your shoulder to help minimize recoil.
    I think that it will almost be a must if you want to shoot it very fast.

    that .50-110 cant have much for a pin even if it were raised.
    I am sitting here with a 458 win mag barrel and my trusty Yugo trunion paper weight. It has a slightly larger chamber than the 45-70 I can assure you the pin will not enter the chamber if left as is. how thin can one go in that area I dont know. But think about this, on a chineese barrel with a 19mm trunion the pin groove gets pretty close to the chamber as well! this handel about the same pressures as you 45-70. You may be able to use it as is.

  2. #12
    Happy Camper hcpookie's Avatar
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    Check this out - I think I'll be OK.

    This article discusses some Marlin lever action conversions. The author was actually able to stuff a .50 AE round into a Marlin - WOW!

    What is Possible with the Marlin?

    The big issue seems to be the behavior of a thin-walled chamber that causes bulging - due to the fact that the threads are inherently weaker than other designs. That will be eliminated because I'll lathe off the threads to prepare for a sleeve of 4130 steel. For a 1" AK trunion, that will mean I'll have about .4" around the radius of the chamber.

    That thick a collar of steel in itself should have enough mass to eliminate bulged/burst chambers. It would certainly take 50,000 CUP and since it appears the barrel itself is made of a high-tensile steel, I should be OK even with those 500 grain slugs.

    The only question that remains is whether or not I need to obtain a throating reamer to open it up for those larger slugs.

  3. #13
    Administrator pirate56's Avatar
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    personally I wouldn't trust that bbl with anything hotter than a smokeless equilivanet of the standart load. lever action receivers are weak, and I don't think they would put a bbl meant for hot loads on a gun like that.
    you really should make a threaded bushing for the breech, turning off the threads to press on a bushing will make the rear thinner. If you really want to test the limits of the round you should get a bbl blank. the 45 70 loaded for a strong rifle is a really potent round.

  4. #14
    Happy Camper hcpookie's Avatar
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    I'm thinking you're right. Everything I've read suggests 40,000 CUP is the confirmed limit for the Marlin 1895 rifle. I found this cartridge listing:

    Garrett Cartridges Online - Products


    ... from the Leverguns forum discussion here (even Noah contributed!):

    Paco Kelly's Leverguns.com :: View topic - NEED A STOUT 45-70 LOAD


    The 50,000 CUP pressure limit is mentioned exactly one time, that of the previous post I listed with the Marlin wildcat conversions (forget the Smith's name).


    I do honestly think the barrel would work, I really do. I would be willing to build it up just to test it out with a stump and string. However I would be faced with other challenges - the barrel sleeve, sleeving the tapered barrel for the barrel components, figuring out the best attachment for a brake on that thin muzzle, etc. etc. that are pushing me toward the "simple" route of getting a barrel blank and reaming to fit. And I'd have that question mark in the back of my head about reliability.

  5. #15
    No Hope For Me 1biggun's Avatar
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    Yikes some of that 45-70 ammo is $185 a box!!!!! (how many boxes you getting LOL) I was looking at that 44 mag+P stuff with 45.00CUP. Its about what I want to load the 44??? to. Maybe I should be working on a a 44 mag instead.

    IMOA you would be better getting a Chamberd blank in your choice of twist from some one an go with a heavyier barrel. Im not sur what you intended usage for this build (short barreld close quarters use or open range shooter or in between) but weight is going to be your friend here I shot my 45-70 this weekend and my shoulder is brused and sore..
    I think you will also get better accuracy as well by having more material at the breach. as any warpage at that end is is going to be greatly magnifed at the other. bushings and all that cant help, not to mension the tension caused buy them. This is going to be a awsome build going with a optimum barrel is going to be safer, more accurate, and likely look better in the end.
    Have you figured out the bolt thrust yet???

  6. #16
    No Hope For Me 1biggun's Avatar
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    HC did you read this part. gets specific on chambr pressures?

    Garrett Cartridges Online

  7. #17
    Happy Camper hcpookie's Avatar
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    Yes I have and the pressures sound about right.

    It is interesting to note that the Lyman manual has a 500 gr. load that doesn't even reach 40,000 CUP. I could probably work up to THAT load in the Marlin barrel and be safe. However I would like to have as much margin for safety as possible, and have the flexibility of those "hot" Hornady loads availble just in case I go on a dinosuar hunt.


    One thing that will push 500 grain loads off of the list is how well it handles for recoil. If it does recoil heavily, even with the semi action, then it would be unusable for a home defense/tactical entry/SWAT/whatever kind of situation. It would even be unusable for dangerous game hunts, because if recoil pushes you so far away from your sight window that you are "searching" for that 2nd shot, then the critter is probably already on top of you.


    At this point, I'm just going to call Green Mountain and profile their barrel. I think my lathe can handle it, but I need to get it in my hands before I can be certain. I don't want to turn if off-centered. If it doesn't then I'll need to find someone with a big enough lathe to handle the contouring for me.

  8. #18
    Gunco Rookie GREGB's Avatar
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    Pookie, Would it be possible to make a collar that is pressed in? Then screw in the barrel from the front. Headspace would be adjustible using an external nut like the Savage bolt action rifles? And you've still got some extra protection around the chamber. Just a thought. I really like your work. Good luck, Greg

  9. #19
    Happy Camper hcpookie's Avatar
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    Sleeving the barrel at the trunion journal was my original plan, however it won't help this particular situation because I can't verify the chamber pressure can handle 50,000 CUP. It may be OK, however I am hesitant to proceed based on one gunsmith's research.

    I doubt Marlin would answer me directly (I haven't asked them yet) about exceeding the Marlin rifle's chamber pressure since it would open them up to legal implications, so they will probably be no help at all. Better to err on the side of caution. If I had the time (and the motivation!) to build up a 2nd gun for testing, I'd do it just to see how it would act. That would prove it once and for all, but I don't want to risk destroying a gun - even for a test project - at this time. Maybe later!

  10. #20
    Gunco Member santanatwo's Avatar
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    Default barrel pin

    instead of shimming it, or using a smaller pin, could you maybe drill for the pin a little higher up, using a virgin trunion.

    I have read about 9mm conversions with small diamerter pins that broke.

    recall the pin (and friction) is what holds in the pressure, just like the lugs on the back side.

    the pin receives a beating every cycle.

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