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Thread: BUILDING A NEW VARMIT AK.

  1. #1
    No Hope For Me 1biggun's Avatar
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    Default BUILDING A NEW VARMIT AK.

    I am in the planning stages of a new 223 varmit build. The varmit II will be an all out attempt at out doing my previous build. I am starting to collect parts and think about how I want it. I bought a match grade, benchrest barrel in 1in 9 twist. This barrel is beautiflly machined it almost seems a shame to cut the threads off it. the thight chamber is possably going to cause feeding issues as well it will require neck turning of quality brass . I am going all out on this build. match barrel, heavy wall reciver, yugo trunion. heavyer scope mounts, milled drop out trigger group that is eaiser to adjust. possably a second trigger group that is set up for singleshot only in the 1 pound or less range the trigger group will also have larger more percisian pins, push button saftey, left hand charge handel so shell catcher wont hit or be in the way, longer mag well an custom mag so I can seat heavy bullets further out like the AR guys do in 1000 meter compition but mine will not have to be hand feed, aluminum float tube fore grip, adjustable muzzel brake (possably if accuracy will not be affected), aluminum gas block with stainless linner and a shut off, also looking at smaller, lighter firing pin posabilitys and a some way of reducing the lock time on the hammer as well. the stock is up in the air but I want a quick adjust rear rest on it and a way to add weight. I am thinking a custom dust cover that will allow easier removel with a even lower scope. I want to get the scope as low as possable to the barrel. it will be a while before it is done but I will post pics unlike the last build. I aqm posting this in the calibur conversion section because It will be on a 7.62x39 kit and parts. the bolt will be Kvar bulgy.

    are there any threaded trunions for a stamped reciver out there avaliable??? was there even such a animal? was thinking a threaded barrel wold be a good idea as it will not have as much stress and tension on it. I am thinking of finding some place were this thing might be competive in a class against AR15,s. I dont compete in rifle shoots but might like to try. maybe 1000 meter or WHAT?? any compitition shooters out there. also looking at a 22 PPC barrel as well.

  2. #2
    GuncoHolic BigAl's Avatar
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    I know the build is the fun part, but it seems you're going to put alot of money and time into something that will perform average at best. I'd be surprised if you achieve anything better than M.O.M at 500 meters on the AK platform.

  3. #3
    No Hope For Me 1biggun's Avatar
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    I'd be surprised if you achieve anything better than M.O.M at 500 meters on the AK platform.
    SUPRISE

    current gun built three years ago



    My first attempt at reloading 2 years ago 5 shots 100 yards of a flat bed truck slight cross wind. work up load 50 grain vmax


    here is 20 rounds shot at moderate pace into two targets no barrel cooling while making scope adjusments at 200 yards! if you look close on the right target you will see a circle around the first five that are touching. I then went to the other target and gave the scope two clicks to the left and took out the center with three rounds. the remainder of the Mag (10 rounds)was then shot into bolth circles. one round of 20 is out side of the orange ( MY fault) the targets are on a stuck on the dust sheild of a 44mm scope to give an idea of there size. this was shot 4 weeks ago sighting in for prairie dog hunt off a flat bed truck but in a rest. very slight cross wind. 50 grain nosler balistic tip h322 powder winchester brass trimed to length. no sorting buy weight or neck turning or any thing complicated. likely room for improvement.

    my current gun will shoot at or under .5" 5 shot groups @100 yards now with a 26" savage take off barrel and a 2.5 LB trigger and cheap optics. and that is with 50 grain varmit bullets. It is on par with most AR 15,s in the $1200 range that I have seen shoot and will out do a lot of them. last month I was routenly taking praire dogs with it at 400 yards with kills out to 600. cross winds and my inablity to adjust optics with any consistancy was the limiting factor that and the 50 grainers just run out of steam.
    I am confident that if the new barrel is any bettter than the factory savage takeoff and I could get the trigger pull to 1.5lbs an be able to load heavy match bullets seated out to were they are even close to the rifleing that I can improve the berformance over my current gun, I hope to shoot 69-77 grain math bullets
    In 223 it is on par with other auto loaders that I have run across in the same calibur (not a lot of them but a few varmit AKs from rock river and DPMS) IF it would be competive in a match, I have no idea. but I certanily feel it will give a good showng against other 223 autos.
    the main cost I,ll have in this is in the barrel and optics. the rest is all labor on custom parts. My current gun was built for under $400. The new build is going to need a good scope no more $75 BSA stuff that hurts my eyes and wont repeat its settings. Im likely looking at $500 to $1000+ in optics but that will be some thing that works on other guns down the road.
    I have not shot it on paper at 500 yards or at a range off a good bench but it will do a hell of a lot better than a meter group at that range.

  4. #4
    Happy Camper hcpookie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1biggun View Post
    SUPRISE
    Yeah I'm in the same boat - my .223 Saiga, shooting Wolf 55 grain, keeps a pretty tight pattern. I sighted in my 3.5x "wide angle" military scope and I was impressed with the performance. I built my rifle into an AK-101 clone, so it has all the AK-74 things on it, such as the muzzle brake. I would say it kept everything in the 9-10 ring IIRC.

    There are about 20 different things that can be done to help improve accuracy on an AK, and on a .223 platform you already have an inherently stable caliber. Check this out - I found a bullpup design from Russia that has a free-floated barrel, VERY COOL BTW, and I would suspect that helps grouping:

    Gunco Member #10

    http://pookieweb.net


    The "original" Boltcutter Rivet Squeezers:
    http://pookieweb.net/AK/rivet/boltcutters/boltcutter.htm


    Project Pink - the Pink and Blue AK-74:
    http://pookieweb.net/pink/pink.htm

  5. #5
    GuncoHolic BigAl's Avatar
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    I'd like to see some 7.62x39 groups at 500 or 1000 meters..

  6. #6
    No Hope For Me 1biggun's Avatar
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    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    I'd like to see some 7.62x39 groups at 500 or 1000 meters..


    BIGAL funny you mentioned that I am working on a .308x39 that I have high hopes for. It is going to use a rechamberd 30-06 barrel stainless sporter profile aproximently 23". It will have some of the features of my first varmit build but the barrel will be lighter. It may not get the custom gas bock and floating tube, Or the 18 punds of carry weight. I do expect/want it to shot a 1"" group however. My amd 65 pistlol that is scoped has shot 1" groups at a 100 with hand loads. I have a line on some lupa brass so we will see how it goes. I bought reamers so I may do a bolt action in 7.62x39 as well and I am looking for a heavy .308 blank for a all out 7.62x39 AK. I have seen some very very tight groups posted buy reloaders with bolt actions in 7.62. there is no reason given my results with the varmit build that a good barrel and ammo in 7.62 will not shoot as well at least at 100 yards. I have no illusions of shooting 1000 meter with it however. (any one now at what range a 7.62round would go subsonic???) that I have a lot of projects on the table right now so it will be a while.

    HC that gun is very very interesting I would like to see the scope mount up close as well as the rest of it. I see the mount is suported by the barrel and the trunion or the RSB. that barrel has to be close to 28" long and that break is huge an the hole looks 30 cal. Do you have any info on it???????.
    My varmit rifle has a floating barrel of sorts. the gas tube is not touching the barrel the piston does ride in the Gas block but it is a loose fit in the carrier. the rsb/scope mount is still pressed onto the barrel but it is mated to the trunion to act like one piece. the fore grip makes no contact what so ever. It shot the same with or without a gas port and tube
    I see the scope mount on a AR15 as a detriment to the system. you have a scope on a aluminum reciver with the barrel screwd into that. if nothing else the expansion and contraction of aluminum being differant from the steel barrel should in theroy throw off the aim. I dont have a lot of AR experiance (I do have 2 recivers for proposed varmit builds here though.) to me the limiting factor of the AK is the bolt lock up. it is pretty sloppy. trueing the bolt to the trunion is tough as the lugs are small and nothing really centers it tightly.
    If you think that sagia shoots good with wolf55 grain try some hand loads or hornady stuff you will likely be more Suprised. mine shot good with factor stuff but got amazing to me with basic reloads.

  7. #7
    No Hope For Me 1biggun's Avatar
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    You guys should check out some of these groups and loads. If to be belived there is a
    .193 group listed there and a lot of .250 groups. the round is accurate also the parent of the 6mm ppc arguably the mosgt accurate in the world. If I can get my 223 to shoot
    .5 groups then thre is no reason a 7.62x39 or .308x39 will not do the same (click on the 7 below for the link)

    7

  8. #8
    GuncoHolic BigAl's Avatar
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    don't take me wrong, i just see the 7.62x39 as anything but a 500m m.o.m cartridge. kinda like a modernized 30-30. I know everything can be improved, but to what extent is it worth it. The .223 round is a little different.

    If I was going to attempt such a project, i believe i would start out with a milled receiver....

  9. #9
    Happy Camper hcpookie's Avatar
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    I don't think anyone has actually taken the time and effort to accurize (is that a word?) a 7.62x39 round. I was really talking about the AK action itself, and a PPC round on an AK action would perhaps be the best all-around tack driver for the AK platform IMO.

    Now I have wondered just how accurate of groups you can get out of the x39, and honestly I think a great deal of it boils down to how good of a barrel and how good of ammo you can get. I think it would benefit greatly from a name-brand barrel, perhaps a bit longer for extra velocity, and hand loads that have had all of the "tricks" done to it, even neck turning. But again, most people are going to put that effort into a "proven" round like the .223 and stick with cheap ammo for their AKs. Which is a shame! Because if my .223 can keep things in the black with a factory barrel, just think what biggun's match-grade barrel could do.
    Gunco Member #10

    http://pookieweb.net


    The "original" Boltcutter Rivet Squeezers:
    http://pookieweb.net/AK/rivet/boltcutters/boltcutter.htm


    Project Pink - the Pink and Blue AK-74:
    http://pookieweb.net/pink/pink.htm

  10. #10
    GuncoHolic BigAl's Avatar
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    I've rechambered 30-30 for 30-30 ackley and the results are amazing. i'm sure you can obtain good results from the x39, but i believe you have to start with the big problems (flex=slop).

    one thing i have never seen is anyone post accuracy results from their x39 from a bolt rifle.

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