so is plastic surgery, teeth, eyes, funerals,Cut me some slack. '74 bolts are rare & expensive nowadays
there is no way you can weld to a bolt and not at least slightly affect the temper around that weld I dont care how small the weld is. that area will be a stress riser and that is were a crack can start. there is no way around it. even if it were retemperd the metal structure will be changed. I persoanly would not risk it. I see K-var is out of 5.45 bolts but they do have 5.56 bolts that could be opend up slightly the extra $50 for a correct bolt is not worth the risk IMOO
CNTRAILRIDER was the bolt pictured from your build?? If it was a blow back how was it attached or locked to the carrier? any picture of the bolt face and the rest of the build?? I would be less concerned of welding on a blow back bolt.
That was my bolt, and it went in this straight-blowback beltfed which I built
The bolt was welded in the BC (and removed) numerous times before it cracked, and I have no doubt that contributed to it's cracking. I replaced it with another sleeved one and it works fine. As far as I know, it's the only beltfed built to date in x25 (that works)
I was told here on Gunco that the cartridge was too weak to operate a BF mech, before I began building it. If I believed everything I read on the gunboards, and heeded all the advice and warnings posted here, I'd never get anything built. All Anglos would still live East of the Mississippi if people thought like that 200 yrs ago. Yes there are risks; all growth has inherent risks, not just building guns. So before Murphy befalls some great tragedy on me tomorrow, I will add that I do take saftey precautions based on what I've learned to date
I am attempting one that's gas operated, but still have a ways to go. There are no guarantees it will work.
The gas port is .191 and it has NOT affected accuracy at all. Yes that is large. And asking a CHEAP little x25 cartridge to drive a BF mech is a LARGE request. Be advised I don't rest my cheek on the stock when firing the first few rounds, after studying how far back the BC travels. A gas-op BF in x25 has never been achieved, as far as I know. The only reason I build this stuff is to have beltfed fun (which is usually expensive) at cheap affordable prices. It can be done, with ingenuity and determination. It can't be done by someone who listens to, and believes others who tell him it can't be done. I've built 6 beltfeds (currently own 10, half are transferrables) and my MG47s are the ones I enjoy most because they're the cheapest to shoot. I don't claim to be an expert, but do have more experience than many folks here
Now, to get back on topic: I have a good CII friend in CO who had a standard un-screwed-with AK bolt BREAK in a 7.62x39 sheetmetal rcvr about 6 yrs ago. It was a transferrable $10K gun shooting good ammo. Cost around $600 (at the 'then' prices) for a pro to return it to like-new condition (including trunnion damage) So stock un-screwed-with AK bolts have been known to break. If you own & shoot MG's on a regular basis, you will eventually see most everything break. Either yours or a buddy's
Steve in El Paso
Now thats a post. and by the way very nice work and guns. I love your out side the box thinking. and yea I should have cut you some slack.
as I mentioned in a blow back I would not be as concrned. I just get fearfull/ parinod that those who dont work much with metal and welding will start thinking its ok do things they shouldnt because we did it or missunderstand what were talking about. Its obvious your no rookie in fact far from it. I admitt I wasnt thinking of your builds in perticular when I posted. I was thinking just some guy built a blowback pistol and welded on the bolt a bunch or someone who was to cheap to buy the correct 5.45 bolt for a rifle build. for that I apoligise for the tone of my post.
I will still stick by my advice on welding on a gas operated gun bolt as failure there with a full on rifle round could likely be fatal if a lug let go. and like i mentioned there is the 223 bolt that can be used with out welding for gas builds. I know that knowlegable builders have built gas operated rifles with adapter rings, but its not for me for the reasons I explained..
I recall being very concerned with the size of your gas ports in past posts and Im glad to say Im wrong apparently. how accurate are those by the way?? thats still a huge port bigger than the bore on my 17-223 project LOL any idea how much MV you are loosing with a port that big?? how much gas comes back your way??The gas port is .191 and it has NOT affected accuracy at all. Yes that is large.
Im suprised you havent just built your own one piece bolt/carrier at this point?? with the price of AK parts now. Im thinking of just making my own bolt / carrier and trunion for a 9mm blow back as there is no need for lugs the temper would not be a huge Issue. Are the guys who soften the sunomi bolts to work on them even retempering them when done???
I hear you I remeamber when i said I wanted to build a ACCURATE AK for varmit hunting. everyone said no way, the reciver flex would kill it, the slopy bolt would kill it, the gas port would kill it, there was no way to mount a scope properly ect and that Id be lucky to get better than a 2" group. and to buy a AR.If I believed everything I read on the gunboards, and heeded all the advice and warnings posted here, I'd never get anything built
Sorry if my post sounded like it aimed at the craftsmanship - not my intention - I was saying "aha" to the question in my mind as to how this happened. If I have read correctly this is NOT a stock bolt, rather a modified (and heat-altered) bolt. "THAT" is what made me say "aha".
We need to either design via emachineshop or perhaps Pirate's business a US-built bolt. I can envision how to make all the cuts except the rotator lug. Can't see how that cut is made.
Gunco Member #10
The "original" Boltcutter Rivet Squeezers:
Project Pink - the Pink and Blue AK-74:
Yes it was altered shape-wise and heat-wise so there were variables at work
I sure could use a BACKWARDS bolt and carrier - one that would extract & eject OPPOSITE - for MG47 builds. As far as I know, no one's ever made lefty AK's. Seen lefty AR's but not AK's. Only place I can imagine one being made is HERE IN AMERICA
Last edited by cntrailrider; 01-09-2009 at 04:16 AM. Reason: meant opposite instead of backwards
safety lever stop plate
The bolt carrier will be the most complicated part. Fortunately, once I get the probe bits installed on the mill I can digitize a right-handed one and then flip the X dimensions around.
some one please make a 3 lug heavy duty version bolt . the standard yugo trunion will work as is I think after looking at my sagia 308, although the 308 bolt is wider than a standard.
biggun where would the third lug engage in a m70 trunnion?
If you look at the LH side you will see what looks like a second lug below the top lug that is were the Saiga lug engages. aside from the groves being wider the trunions apear damm near the same. Im pretty sure if I reduced the width of a the bolt lugs a sagia bolt would work. the third lug is in on the bottom of the bolt and rotates to the left.