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1st x25 starting tomorrow

5K views 31 replies 8 participants last post by  smartbomb 
#1 ·
been reading on some of the things ya'll have been building. 1) i'm learning 2)trying to convince myself its ok to hack up perfectly good parts 3) based on what i've read, it really is ok to f'up said parts. 4) this place is outstanding

in a nutshell i got this bug/disease/psychosis after doing 3 saiga conversions. for my first magic trick i will be attempting an x25 blowback build. today i got lucky and was given 2 bent flats by a friend that is an AR guy and has "no use" for ak parts. i am delighted because i do not need to bend the 4 flats i have right now.

so after 8 months of searching, reading and asking typical noob questions, i am ready to actually start putting parts together. this will not happen overnite. i have a wife who has her own ideas on how my free time is allocated (honey do's). better yet i read in an ancient thread here (trx iirc) taking you time is better than rushing.

my camera battery is charging. i will start some pix tomorrow. i am sure i will get stuck and need some answers. so big thanks in advance!

Im going to just get a block of 1 1/4" x 3" steel and start milling when its dont it will look like what im thinking. If I could design on a computer I wouldent be sitting here broke.
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biggun, i can help ya with that. never built an ak but i know cad like the back of my hand
 
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#2 ·
Watch out building these things is a friggin sickness. I've been goin thru the building DTs cuz just got married last June and bought a house and no spare time/change. Gotta keep my priorities and am sitting in a hunting blind at dark thirty as I am writing this. The guys on here are the best and am sure your project will come in time. Best of luck with the build.
 
#5 ·
viper

bolt/carrier is still up in the air. i have a romy x39 that i can shim like the 2xtm version. i have an offer of a 74 bolt. given this is blowback i think i can take a liberty or two. i really like the bolt eod has for the x25. $200 is going to be difficult to scrape up. that being said, and reading a bunch of threads by hcpookie/biggun/trx and others i cannot recall, all i really need is a heavy hunk of metal with some slots and holes. i am being overly simple but in reality that all it is. i ran across a 2d cad file of an AKM74SUA1 that is blowback. i took the profile and section view and did a 3d model to see how difficult of a job it would be to get milled.



in my mind, this is a 2 part peice, the bolt and the guide rod. they can either thread or pin together still working the extractor out in drawing. i have simplified the bolt drawing somewhat to make the mill work really straightforward.

as for the mag, its going to be ppsh 41. they are ordered just waiting for delivery

as for the mag well, i really like the clean simplicity of this one. it looks like it is rock and lock just like i'm used to. i am trying to find the build details but have had no luck.



i am in no hurry to get this done. i want to take my time and learn. i do not need to reinvent the wheel. there are many successful builds here i can reference.
 
#6 ·
Hello smartbomb,
If you have access to a metal lathe perhaps you can modify a hardware store bolt to serve as your "bolt". That would require gun drilling the bolt for a firing pin and slotting the head for extractor and ejector... Slotting can be done on a mill or by hand with an angle grinder or die grinder with abrasive discs.

A nut at the back can secure the custom bolt into the carrier. I would avoid using a hardened bolt to drill and carve on.

This could help save re-inventing the wheel and save a few bux.

VD
 
#7 ·
if expediency is the way i go, then the standard 74 or 47 bolt/carrier will do. i would love to mill my own bolt but thats a skill i have yet to acquire. there is a guy not far from here that has a cnc and is a gun builder. he is a friend of a friend. so far i havent had a chance to meet him. hopefully i will get the chance. at this point i have enough to do with the rest of the build.
 
#8 ·
Nice, an under folder, I'll keep an eye on this.


as for the mag, its going to be ppsh 41.
as for the mag well, i really like the clean simplicity of this one. it looks like it is rock and lock just like i'm used to. i am trying to find the build details but have had no luck.
I don't know how the mag well was done on the one in the pic, but the PPsH41 mags go straight in, I don't know if you'll be able to do a rock n lock on those.
 
#9 ·
Nice, an under folder, I'll keep an eye on this.



I don't know how the mag well was done on the one in the pic, but the PPsH41 mags go straight in, I don't know if you'll be able to do a rock n lock on those.
i know, its hard to tell by the picture. i really want to find a build write up on this one. i grabbed this image from a thread here a while ago but do not remember whose it is.

yep the underfolder was not what i had in mind when i started collecting parts. the professor put this one up for sale and i jumped on it. it must have been destiny because i was hooked up with 2 underfolder receivers from a friend thursday.
 
#12 ·
1bg muttman

kiss is the way i look at everything. i work in the engineering field and it amazes me at how many seemingly competent engineers NEEDLESSLY over complicate designs. i have gotten into more pissing contest over this than one should.

now on to more important things. i have a chunk of square stock. what i do not know is whether i need exotic steel (ie 4130). what i have is regular run of the mill steel. my thoughts were, if i go this route, is to drill it cut it heat it quench it. if you really look at the eod bolt, it is a simple as it gets. 1bg you mention welding the guide rod like the eod bolt. i read somewhere on another board, several were slamming the welded process. i didnt feel that was an issue. there are purist who think it has to be the "perfect" way or no way. based on the numbers of ak's running around places that have nothing more than a camels hip bone for tools, i think i may be ok.
 
#14 ·
Id go with a better steel also the price of it will be small change in the long run. you can heat treat it then if you desire.

As far a purists an the AK, I see it like this you can have perfect rivets, spot welds,demples, markings ect and it will still never be original and a fake is a fake now matter how you make it look. unless its a original full auto then its never going to be the same. I saw the other day were some air soft guys were going to great lenghts to make there guns look origional as well LOL. In the long run its about as important as a Beanie babay that has a certain color thread VS one that dont. :) I admire the work and skill it take to do a build like that but its still not a real AK so why get that carried away. I saw a VW bug awhile back with a fake rolls front end on it and it made me think of how a SA AK is really just a fake also.

if your not into having a welded part then just make the block taller and thread in a gas pistion. Im not real sure why you neven need the rod or pistion or gas tube at all. Id just eleminate all un needed parts. I plan on doing a guide rod type deal on mine I dont see the since in having a non functional gas block,tube an pistion loose the weight IMOO. Id keep only the needed parts if i was building from scratch.
 
#15 ·
I saw a VW bug awhile back with a fake rolls front end
And to add to that, it's like saying "I have a Porsche" and then show me a VW Bug :D

I'd think the only thing the fake piston like EOD uses might help keep the bolt straight if the bolt is made kind of short in length. Just guessing at this, never tested it.
 
#16 ·
i was wondering the same about th rod. unless it adds some weight i dont see the point either. the mpi69 22 trainer doesnt have one. bg i'm with you. a guide rod makes better sense. i am lookingat some 4140 steel frm a place tht sells remnants. its called onlinemetals. an 18" long bar of 1.5" dia round was $18. they didnt have any square in stock.
 
#21 ·
Smartbomb, please take plenty of progress pics, as I want to build one of these next summer, once I get the 3 current builds done and off my plate, and some $$$ put back on. I have been interested for awhile, but other projects were on the gotta build it list. TIA,
 
#23 ·
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jackpot! industrial metals 4130 Flat Bar 1" X 1 1/4" X 12" $9.00
Hmmm might be just what I need for some of my cantalever scope mounts. I want to be able to temper them to make them stiffer and les prone to bending.

Id like to find some 1/1/4 a 2" for some bolts and other projects. I want to do some rear trunions with threads for a AR buffer tube all in one piece
 
#25 ·
bg you seem to have a handle on milling. for small stuff like a bolt, would an xy table on a drill press work?
I wouldn't try it with steel, you might be able to get away with it on aluminum, you'll just wear out the bearing fast and it most likely get chatter.
 
#27 ·
Hello smartbomb,
As Coils said the drillpress has miserable bearings and rigidity for milling. Most X-Y axis vises or tables are also very marginal for mill work.

That said... It is possible to do some modest grinding work using a decent drillpress. By grinding I mean using fiber abrasive discs held with an arbor in the drillpress chuck. They can slice and slot some small work OK.

Some small die grinder or Dremel burrs can be used in a drillpress to approximate milling. I have used this technique also for model airplane work on metal including steel. It can chatter big time if you get carried away taking large cuts.

There have been plans for adding an extra bearing/extension to a drill press so it can handle the side forces much better. I haven't tried that one as yet.

Otherwise milling in a drillpress is a rather persistent myth. I suggest shopping for a real millng machine or a friend who has one !!! A friend with a mill who would teach you how to use it is a great start. That's how I got started. Then I got my own small bench mill (a used Atlas) by trading a couple Mauser rifles.

VD
 
#28 ·
cool! i figured as much. friend of a friend has one and cousin i havent seen in years may also(he was the industrial arts director at my high school many yrs ago).

anyway, cooking a big bird and have about 30 headin my way. ya'll have a great thanksgiving.
 
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