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Thread: 6MM HAGAR

  1. #1
    No Hope For Me 1biggun's Avatar
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    Default 6MM HAGAR

    OK IN MY QUEST FOR THE BEST 6MM AK ROUND I FOUND THIS.

    THE 6MM HAGAR IS MADE FOR THE AR IT USES A 6.8 SPC BOLT FACE AN HAS 37.61 WATER GRAINS OF CAPACITY. SONDS PRETTY GOOD HORNADY IS MAKING CORRECT MARKED BRASS AN THE ROUND HAS WON EVENTS.

    INFO


    6mm HAGAR

    THIS MIGHT BE THE EASY ROAD FOR A AK BUILD AN LESS BOT THRUST.



    THIS IS FROM 6MMBR,COM
    CAMP PERRY--Carl Bernosky Wins High Power Championship with AR: Pennsylvanian Carl R. Bernosky won top honors at the 2007 National Rifle Association High Power Rifle Championship Matches held at Camp Perry, Ohio, from August 6-10, at the Centennial Camp Perry Matches. A shooter with over 30 years of experience on the firing line at Camp Perry, Bernosky has previously won this prestigious award seven times. To take first place and win the title of High Power Rifle champion, Bernosky posted a score of 1787-89X. He was awarded the prestigious Mumma Trophy for his achievement. Second place went to David Tubb of Canadian, Texas, with a score of 1779-86X. Tubb also finished in the National Match Rifle Championship. Third place went to Ronald L. Zerr of El Paso, Texas, who posted a score of 1776-75X.

    Along with the overall High Power championship, Bernosky won the Match Rifle Championship, Civilian Championship, and Carl took top honors in the Vandenburg Cup Match (798-47X); Nevada Trophy Match (598-28X); McCann Trophy Match (600-38X); Members Trophy Match (199-11X); Scott Trophy Match (200-17X); Erdman Trophy Match (588-23X); and Marine Gunner D. I. Boyd II Memorial Trophy Match (1187-51X). All in all, Carl put together a truly spectacular performance at Perry in 2007.

    Bernosky was shooting a semi-auto AR15-platform rifle with a Smith & Wesson M&P lower, John Holliger match upper chambered in 6mm Hagar, 26" Krieger barrel (+ 6" bloop tube), with a Geiselle two-stage trigger. We are told this is the first time in Camp Perry history that the High Power Championship was won with an AR15 style semi-auto. The 6mm Hagar resembles a 6.8 SPC with a .100" longer body, 30-degree shoulder, and greater case capacity. It has a .420 rim diameter, and is formed from .30 Remington brass. According to John, the 6mm Hagar has a lot of advantages for the AR15 platform. First, the 6mm Hagar has enough case capacity (more than a Grendel) to shoot the 105s at optimal velocities. Second, the Hagar's smaller rim diameter (compared to a 6BR or 6.5 Grendel) produces less bolt thrust (an issue with the AR15). Third, the Hagar's relatively old-fashioned long, narrow case feeds more reliably than "modern" short, fat designs.

  2. #2
    Gunco Addicted for life j427x's Avatar
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    it looks pretty good. i haven't noticed any bolt thrust problems with the 6.5 or feeding problems with a properly sized case.

    more case volume that could help. i figure if the DOD ever goes with a new round it will probably be a slightly longer 6mm hagar cause it will works better in belts than the short cased 6.5g--

    something like a 6mm hagar +5-6mm length.

    what kind of speed will this make out of a realistic barrel length like a 20" or 16"?

  3. #3
    GuncoHolic 2ndAmendican's Avatar
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    That does sound interesting. So what kind of mag does that fit in? Or does it have a proprietary mag?
    Enforcement, NOT Amnesty!!!!!!

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  4. #4
    No Hope For Me 1biggun's Avatar
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    well it fits a 223 ar type mag not sure what it is exactly.

    the case holds 37.5 grains water thats a lot more than a 223 or x39.

    I think they were getting 2900-3000 out of a 1of bullet.

    what really pisses me of is three day ago PTG had a hager reamer on clearance for $55 an I didnt know what it was i went back to snatch it up an it was long gone. for that money it was worth a try. brass was almost impossable to get an it looked like a lot of guys shelved the idea as resizing gut down 30 remington brass. was not wrth it.

    it appears that hornady is making brass for sale or at least for sale to the guys who designed the round to sell to us.

    It has more case capacity than a grendel so its going to make a better round IMO .

    im not sure if im going to go with one but its interesting. Id like to have a 30 rounds to see how they fir variuos 223 ak type mags. maybe ill buy some brass an seat some bullets buy hand to see.

    WOULD BE A SMPLE REBARREL FOR A 223 AK OR MY VARMINT BUILD IF A STANDARD MAG IS USABLE OR A STANDARD MAG WITH EASY MODS. OR A AR ADDAPTER AN THE RIGHT MAG.

    IT WONT RUN THE LONG BULLETS FROM A MAG IN SA HOWEVER SO THERE ARE SOME ISSUES WITH IT. AT SHORT RANGE A LIGHER 223 BULLET CAN GO A LOT FASTER AN YOU DONT CARE ABOUT HIGH BC. IN A AK WITH A MODIFES LENGTH MAG IT WOULD BE DOABLE. IM STILL THINKING 6MM BR, DASHER OR BRX IS A BETTER CHICE FOR THE AK. IF 308 BRASS CAN BE CUT DOWN AN USED THERE IS ALWAYS GOING TO BE BRASS IN SOME FORM AVALIABLE.

  5. #5
    No Hope For Me 1biggun's Avatar
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    LOADS TAKEN FROM THE LINK ABOVE IF THIS IS NOT OK PLEASE REMOVE OR HAVE ME REMOVE IT . LOOKS LIKE ABOUT 3000 FPS WITH A 87 GRAIN VMAX. THAT WILL BLOW THE DOOES OFF ANY 223 LOAD AN REALLY CHALLANGES THE 22-250 AT LONG RANGE.


    Varmint Loads (See below for highpower load data)

    Here are chrono results with some 6mm HAGAR Varmint Loads.

    Note: All loads shot from an upper with a 24" Pac Nor 1:12" twist barrel with a shorter throated
    HAGAR chamber (i.e. throated for smaller varmint bullets). All loads were shot from modified magazines and were loaded at 2.340" OAL.

    VV N133 Powder

    27 gr. N133, 205M AR Primer, Sierra 55 gr BlitzKing bullet 3071 fps
    28 gr. N133, 205M AR Primer, Sierra 55 gr BlitzKing bullet 3206 fps
    29 gr. N133, 205M AR Primer, Sierra 55 gr BlitzKing bullet 3320 fps
    30 gr. N133, 205M AR Primer, Sierra 55 gr BlitzKing bullet 3435 fps

    27 gr. N133, 205M AR Primer, Sierra 70 gr BlitzKing bullet 2965 fps
    28 gr. N133, 205M AR Primer, Sierra 70 gr BlitzKing bullet 3104 fps
    29 gr. N133, 205M AR Primer, Sierra 70 gr BlitzKing bullet 3207 fps
    30 gr. N133, 205M AR Primer, Sierra 70 gr BlitzKing bullet 3322 fps

    Hodgdon H322 Powder

    27 gr. H322, 205M AR Primer, Sierra 55 gr BlitzKing bullet 2948 fps
    28 gr. H322, 205M AR Primer, Sierra 55 gr BlitzKing bullet 3064 fps
    29 gr. H322, 205M AR Primer, Sierra 55 gr BlitzKing bullet 3199 fps
    30 gr. H322, 205M AR Primer, Sierra 55 gr BlitzKing bullet 3337 fps
    31 gr. H322, 205M AR Primer, Sierra 55 gr BlitzKing bullet 3465 fps

    27 gr. H322, 205M AR Primer, Sierra 70 gr BlitzKing bullet 2887 fps
    28 gr. H322, 205M AR Primer, Sierra 70 gr BlitzKing bullet 3016 fps
    29 gr. H322, 205M AR Primer, Sierra 70 gr BlitzKing bullet 3162 fps
    30 gr. H322, 205M AR Primer, Sierra 70 gr BlitzKing bullet 3257 fps

    Hodgdon Benchmark Powder

    30 gr. Benchmark, 205M AR Primer, Sierra 55 gr BlitzKing bullet 3259 fps
    31 gr. Benchmark, 205M AR Primer, Sierra 55 gr BlitzKing bullet 3356 fps
    29 gr. Benchmark, 205M AR Primer, Sierra 70 gr BlitzKing bullet 3069 fps
    30 gr. Benchmark, 205M AR Primer, Sierra 70 gr BlitzKing bullet 3172 fps

    _________________________

    Highpower Loads Note: The magazine loadings with the Hornady 87 gr. V-Max bullet and the Nosler 95 gr Ballistic Tip bullet are also suitable for hunting.

    Here are chrono results with some 6mm HAGAR Highpower Loads.

    Note: All loads shot from an upper with a 28" Krieger 1:8" twist barrel with a HAGAR chamber suitable for highpower.

    The 105 - 108 gr. bullets were all loaded long for single loading only and all bullets less than 105 gr. were loaded at 2.340" OAL and used with modified magazines and magazine fed.

    VV N140 Powder

    28.0 gr. N140, 205M AR Primer, Horn 87 gr V-Max bullet 2716 fps
    29.0 gr. N140, 205M AR Primer, Horn 87 gr V-Max bullet 2800 fps

    28.0 gr. N140, 205M AR Primer, Nosler 95 gr BT bullet 2619 fps
    29.0 gr. N140, 205M AR Primer, Nosler 95 gr BT bullet 2702 fps

    29.5 gr. N140, 205M AR Primer, Berger 105 gr. Hybrid bullet 2791 fps
    30.0 gr. N140, 205M AR Primer, Berger 105 gr. Hybrid bullet 2860 fps

    VV N540 Powder

    29.5 gr. N540, BR-4 Primer, Berger 108 gr. BT bullet 2781 fps
    30.3 gr. N540, BR-4 Primer, Berger 108 gr. BT bullet 2842 fps

    29.7 gr. N540, BR-4 Primer, Berger 105 gr. Hybrid bullet 2806 fps

    IMR 8208 XBR Powder

    28.0 gr. 8208 XBR, BR-4 Primer, Horn 87 gr V-Max bullet 2864 fps
    29.0 gr. 8208 XBR, BR-4 Primer, Horn 87 gr V-Max bullet 2961 fps
    29.5 gr. 8208 XBR, BR-4 Primer, Horn 87 gr V-Max bullet 3028 fps

    28.0 gr. 8208 XBR, BR-4 Primer, Nosler 95 gr BT bullet 2762 fps
    29.0 gr. 8208 XBR, BR-4 Primer, Nosler 95 gr BT bullet 2870 fps

    28.0 gr. 8208 XBR, BR-4 Primer, Horn 105 gr A-Max bullet 2734 fps
    29.0 gr. 8208 XBR, BR-4 Primer, Horn 105 gr A-Max bullet 2836 fps *
    * Showing some pressure signs - maybe pull back to 28.7 gr.

    Hodgdon Benchmark Powder

    28.0 gr. Benchmark, 205M AR Primer, Horn 87 gr V-Max bullet 2909 fps
    29.0 gr. Benchmark, 205M AR Primer, Horn 87 gr V-Max bullet 3028 fps


    28.0 gr. Benchmark, 205M AR Primer, Nosler 95 gr BT bullet 2812 fps
    29.0 gr. Benchmark, 205M AR Primer, Nosler 95 gr BT bullet 2911 fps

    28.0 gr. Benchmark, 205M AR Primer, Berger 105 gr Hybrid bullet 2800 fps
    29.0 gr. Benchmark, 205M AR Primer, Berger 105 gr Hybrid bullet 2891 fps**
    ** Max Load

    Reloader 15 Powder

    28.0 gr. RL15, 205M AR Primer, Horn 87 gr V-Max bullet 2692 fps
    29.0 gr. RL15, 205M AR Primer, Horn 87 gr V-Max bullet 2812 fps

    29.0 gr. RL15, 205M AR Primer, Berger 105 gr Hybrid bullet 2767 fps
    30.0 gr. RL15, 205M AR Primer, Berger 105 gr Hybrid bullet 2861 fps


    _________________________

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