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Rhodesian FAL Questions?

17K views 48 replies 17 participants last post by  mtdew 
#1 ·
I've talked myself into building a beater FAL, somethign that I won't cry about if I scratch it. NOT a safe queen.

My plan is to buy a cheap-o kit & Sarco folding stock, chop the barrel, and build it into a folding stock carbine.

Been looking at some of the mid-range FAL kits that are currently available. I don't want to use an STG kit because they are so darned nice, that I'd like to see them go fulfill their destiny. So I'm looking at either Rhodesian FAL kits or one of the other "used" kits floating around out there. Currently here's what I've found:

http://www.ammunitionstore.com - Rhodie kit
http://www.gunthings.com - "South African" kits (looks like Rhodie kits to me, probably are)
http://www.sarcoinc.com/fnfal.html - assorted FAL kits
http://www.thedealerwarehouse.com - misc FAL stuff

OK so I've grown tired of search 8 bazillion posts on FALFILES :(

Questions I have:
1. What is needed to convert a normal FAL to folding stock? What parts?
2. Anyone have the skinny on how well Rhodie parts kits shoot? 2 MOA? 10? Tumbling bullets?

TIA,
- Jerry
 
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#2 ·
DSA makes a milled aluminum top cover that does not need the "para cut". The cover has the scope rail, so it eliminates any possibility of original appearance. The para cut can be made in any receiver, but this cover eliminates the need to do any extra work.

DSA also makes a para bolt carrier. This thing isn't cheap, but it does get you another U.S. part.

I bought the top cover, para recoil spring set, and bolt carrier to go with my Sarco folding lower. These parts set me back about $235, but I had been unable to find a para carrier and I really like the DSA scope rail top cover on my Imbel. A para rear sight will run you another $55 to $60 from DSA. You can get various other sights that can be adapted to the para lower, as seen on the FALFiles.

The Sarco lower is stripped, but you can reuse the latch parts, hammer strut, and triggerguard from your parts kit. Be careful when you get around to refinishing it. There's a post on FALFiles showing the Sarco buttpad melted during a refinishing episode.

I bought 3 kits from Gunthings, and every one was underrated according to their descriptions. The kits are ugly on the outside, but cleaned up nicely. The bores were great and there wasn't excessive play once the bolt and carrier were installed in the receiver.

After looking at the Ammunitionstore.com ad, I would probably go with the Gunthings.com South African kit. It's a few dollars more, but it's not a jumble of mixed parts.

If you go with an FSE trigger group, U.S. piston, U.S. charging handle, DSA carrier, and U.S. floorplates, you'll have your 7 parts. This would allow you to use a cheaper Imbel imported receiver. Tapco carries the gas pistons, charging handles, and furniture (if you want to swap pistol grip and handguards).
 
#3 ·
DSA Extreme Duty Para Scope Mount:

http://www.dsarms.com/item-detail.cfm?ID=620PARA&storeid=1&image=scopemntpara.gif

DSA Para Bolt Carrier

http://www.dsarms.com/item-detail.cfm?ID=P033&storeid=1&image=paracarr.gif


It is possible that the DSA receiver already has the para cut for use with all configurations. The only options when I ordered it was Type I, II, or III, with or without carry handle cut.

I installed both of these on my standard DSA Type 1 receiver and it functions perfectly. When I ordered the carrier, I asked if there was any special machining that was needed on the receiver to use it, they told me no. I was under the impression that the para cut was just a relief for the extra tab on the top cover. Of course, I did tell them that I had a DSA receiver...

The first pic is the inside of the receiver. It sure looks like the para cut...

The second pic shows the clearance between the DSA para bolt and DSA receiver.

Do you have a pic of the inside of an Imbel or Coonan receiver?
 

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#4 ·
r2d2 said:
Wow, para bolt don't need a para cut.

I like to see that too!
I didn't say bolt, I said cover... I'm thinking my DSA receiver already has the clearance cut in it. I was under the impression that only the cover needed a relief cut. I never even thought about building a paratrooper version before because of the cost of parts, so I never bothered researching the extra machining.

The DSA bolt looks identical to the one that frankie posted.

Here's a FALFiles thread that talks about making the para cut.

http://www.falfiles.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=120850
 
#5 ·
Nah, Jerry's the kind of guy to make a custom cutter to do his own para cut.

After I looked up the pic of the para cut on FALFiles, I thought it looked kind of familiar. DSA must add the cut on all their receivers to make it easy to build a paratrooper version. That would explain why my rifle functioned perfectly with both carriers...

It looks like I better plan on making a cutter if I'm going to use an Imbel receiver (unless they can be ordered with the cut).
 
#6 ·
Yeah DSAs Para bolt carriers and Para dust covers are back ordered right now. I 'm waiting on both now. I have a DSA type 2 receiver and was told all I needed was their bolt carrier para spring set and cover and sight. I purchased the Sarco "Rhodesian Para stock and para sight. I hope my receiver is like Rhino's!!!
 
#10 ·
Nice pics Templar. I've always loved their camo pattern and the innovative vehicles they made. I bought a brand new camo field jacket and a used LS shirt and pants back in the eighties but they are all a medium size and I outgrew them. :tearsdrip
 
#12 ·
I cannot wait until I get my first FAL.

My dealer should recieve it next month and hopefully I can get it paid off by the "4th".

Awesome pics Templar.

Are you a vet of the Rhodesian war ?

IMHO the governments of the so-called "free world" sure did drop the ball on that one......

I still feel that we should go into Zimbabwee and South Africa and destroy both POS regimes that are in power.

"Be a man among men, join the Rhoedesian army"
 
#13 ·
Rhino, that is not a para cut rcvr.
Not big or deep enough. DSA recievers do not come -pre-cut.
This is a pra cut:

The DSA "ED" cover does not have the tab, that is why it fit... as metioned above, the carrier does not require the cut, only the original top cover.
 
#14 ·
HCPookie, I really look forward to seeing it. I just got my FAL from Bobby @ www.SalBOArms.com and I requested it in O/D. Looks supersweet with O/D furniture. If I remember correctly, The Rhodies all were standard black and painted over with O/D, or another green variant, and a camo pattern to boot. If you're not doing the finish on it come up with a pattern you like and have Bobby give you a quote. I'll try and post a pic of my rifle and I may pull out it's identical kit for a before shot.
 
#16 ·
Pa.Patriot said:
Rhino, that is not a para cut rcvr.
Not big or deep enough. DSA recievers do not come -pre-cut.
This is a pra cut:

The DSA "ED" cover does not have the tab, that is why it fit... as metioned above, the carrier does not require the cut, only the original top cover.
DSA says that the cover fits any FAL receiver that is in spec, metric or inch. So I knew that the cover would fit my DSA or any other receiver I purchase down the road to use the folder parts on.

If the carrier will work on any receiver as well, I'm happy. That makes my project just a little easier. Just need to shorten the barrel and open the gas port.

Now, can you tell me how to get the folding stock apart? It looks like the catch needs to be pushed to release the lock, and then the pivot pin driven down and out of the block.
 
#18 ·
Wow thanks for all that info! Going to have to chew on this one a while...

Frankie the "beater stock sets" are sold "as-is" non-functional. Need to be taken apart, repaired, then reassembled.

Rhino, IF the FAL is the same as the FNC then I can post some close-up pics of the folding assembly, just let me know. I would assume they are at least close. The look the same...
 
#20 ·
frankie, My Sarco lower is fully functional and in decent shape. I want to Gun-Kote it, so disassembly is necessary for a proper paint job. I'm not talking about removing the folder assembly from the lower, that's easy. I want to know how to get the stock off of the rear block at the hinge pin.

Jerry, thanks for the FNC pics. From the schematic on FALFiles, it looks like there is a cross pin in the top boss of the hinge that needs to be removed. The pin may be disguised by the crappy paint that Sarco sprayed on the whole assembly...

http://falfiles.com/forums/showthread.php?postid=1205998#post1205998
 
#21 ·
The cross pin I see on mine is on the RH side, facing front-to-back, and can be seen in this pic:

http://pookieweb.dyndns.org:61129/FNC/stock/DSCN0237.JPG

That's the only cross-pin that I see. Looking more closely, I can almost bet that is how it comes apart. It seems that cross pin is driven out, then the vertical hinge pin - the main one - is driven downward from the top. The latch mechanism appears to be designed so that it will move to the "unlatched" position (button engaged) when it is hammered out. That's my guess. In that schematic, the parts that will be hammered out are shown down behind the pistol grip. Appears to be a spring and that long stepped shaft. The pin behind it is what keeps the stock tubes installed on the rear boss.

The little front-to-back cross pin that starts this off is shown just to the left of that guy's blue arrow.
 
#22 ·
Foobarr said:
HCPookie,
I got the FAL tools, chop saw, barrel die, sand blaster, and 6-hrs of Gunplumbers' FAL DITY videos. Bring a 12-pack.
I'll have to take you up on that! :D

OK so let me get this straight -

The parts that make a para different from a normal FAL are:
- the bolt carrier
- top cover
- receiver cut
- buttstock

Correct?

That milling operation on the carrier seems trivial - one relief cut in the rear only? Or on both the front and the rear?
 
#23 ·
Jerry== I know nothing of value here but Gunplumber posted on the board the other day and I think his post had a link. He may be helpful.
 
#25 ·
Here's my math -

$100 "needs work" para stock
$200 rhodie kit
$150-$250 coonan (?) receiver
+US parts
+para carrier *OR* quality shop time tweaking a normal carrier into a para style (aka the gunplumber method).

Say, $600-700 give-or-take for a beater Para build? I'm not talking a safe queen, just something to kick around with. In fact I may weather the receiver & stock to match the kit's 'used' appearance. Beats the $2800 I saw for the last one I had priced at a gun show.

Dunno, but I think this sounds like a good investment to me. Going to have to buy some of those stocks...
 
#26 ·
I located the retainer pin. The ends were peened and dressed off like the AK gas piston pin, and it was painted over. That won't be too tough to get apart.

I'm also going to make a replacement screw out of steel for the stock block, like the ones being sold on FALFiles.
 
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