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Thread: ACCURIZING THE AK

  1. #51
    No Hope For Me 1biggun's Avatar
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    there is a 2" block just forward of the reciver that is bored 1" as my barrel increasses in size after the trunion. the block is the same width as the reciver every thing a 1/4" forward of the barrel pin is mounted to that block. I cut the buttom of a RSB off and welded it into a milled slot on the block that is pressed on the barrel then I milled the top of the RSB off and welded in a plate that extends back ofer the reciver about 2 inches. I then screwed down a solid steel rail i milled and then tempered to that.the block is bressed tight to the trunion face and was even lapped, I pinned it with two pins.
    I seriously doubt you could get .00000001 defelection between the block n the barrel and trunion. how ever the entire RSB/optics mount is still fastened on the barrel only. ill try to get a better picture of it.

    MY therory is that all barrel harmonics/movement are forward of the heavy block presses tightly against the trunon face. The scope is mounted to the closest edge of those harmonics and if the barrel walkes when it gets hot the mount will follow it slightly and maintain a POA. the reciver stock fore grip ect has no factor in maintaing POA, those parts can affecct how the round is seated in the chamber and affect accuracy but the scope is still pointin the same place evey time. (AT LEAST IN THEORY) I shot 10 shot groups a quarter will cover at 200 YDS so so something is working right.

    I cant wait to see how your mount on a milled reciver works out I think it will be just fine.

  2. #52
    No Hope For Me 1biggun's Avatar
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    here this should help. man that gun looks beat up in a close up. Its got around 3500 rounds through it now after 5 seasons of use. still shoots good but the barrel is starting ne cleaning more often and its getting picker with the loads. still will do under 1/2 groups, or least it did this spring the last time it was on paper( 900 ronds ago) every thing between the crudely cut away Saiga fore grip and the reciver is were the RSB attaches to the barrel.
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  3. #53
    No Hope For Me 1biggun's Avatar
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    the bipod is attached to the floating fore grip with a sling swivel stud I made to fit the Saiga threads. the whole gun was thrown together from what ever I had laying around in about 4 long days . My kid may start shooting it when i get my new one done.

  4. #54
    No Hope For Me 1biggun's Avatar
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    So let me get this straight ..........the 2" block has a 1" hole bored through her.....is it a slip fit around the barrel or is it pressed on?
    Pressed on with a .005 pressfit and pressed against the trunion face and pinned with two pins.

    And how is the 2" block attached to the front trunnion ? Just the two pins you mentioned? ... Any bolts? ... Weld?...anything??
    Just the two pins holt it on no welding or anything attaching it to the trunion its just pressed tight against it and pinned

    Im having a hard time following what your writing ,but it doesn't really sound like the front mount is "bouncing around" with the barrel though.... rather more like you've effectively 'lengthened' the front trunnion , which is an idea I'd been tossing around in my head for awhile as well.
    Its on the barrel but its tight against the trunion In fact I lapped the two parts together so there was 100% contact. MY therory is the mount cant move much with the barrel since its tight to the trunion and that the barrel would be free floating forward of the trunion.

    If you took the red part of your drawing and ran a rail back from it over the reciver 5" and didnt tie the mount to the trunion in any way you would have basicaly the same set up I have. if it was a press barrel build and it was pinned thight against the trunion face it would be Identical.

    Im working on a switch barrel set up (there is a thread in the AK build forum here called my sons switch barrel ak) and Im thinking of a mount very simular to what you drew but I might some how mill the trunion so it will interface the mount and hold it when the barrel is unscrewed. I plan on using a barrelnut/jam nut like a savage bolt action. basicaly I will sandwich the mount between the trunion and the nut tightly fitted some how.

    And BIGGUN....3500 + rounds on a screw-build AK ??!!??
    Yea and no loctite as I keep pulling it apart to mess with this or that. it has never come loose. not only are the screws supporting the recoil there holding up around 8 pounds of 26" long barrel and scope that is unsupported by hand guard or anything. I shoot pretty hot loads as well. the rear trunion is crossbolted and has nuts on the other side. this build was made to be taken apart and to be test bed for other stuff. It wasent made to be pretty I went 24 hours with out sleep the last day I built it to be done in time for a Pdog hunt.


    Cool, it's free floated? Here I just thought you were being very consistent in gripping the rifle. Mind posting pics of the brackets to hold the handguard, I've thought of something involving a tube welded to the front trunnion that goes around the barrel with 1/8" of clearance for the barrel, and boring out the handguards enough to fit over the tube, and making a new retainer to fit over the larger diameter tube. It would also allow usage of the stock sling location, but the scope mounting on the reciever wouldn't work too well as the front trunnion would be easily moved a little bit from force on the sling attachment point.
    I put a reinforcement plate in inside the reciver with threaded holes I installed the butcherd Saiga fore grip into the reciver like normal and then ran A milled aluminum plate under the foregrip to add support. I really didnt have time to do any thing differant.

    a easy way to get a floaating fore end would to just use a amd fore end and bolt it to the reciver or weld it for that matter just leave the end cap over size. I am going to use a round tube next time and incorperate it into the reciver some how. a extnsion that slid in under the trunion could be used. The gas tube just lays in a slot on the gas block I made . the next GB will be aluminum with a stainless sleave. I have a 2.5" tight fitting bore on that one for the piston to run in try to reduce part size. Im not sure I gained much and may just go more traditional next build. That blaoc is way to heavy and bulky but given the time frame it as all I could do. It works so I leave it be.

    asthetics was not a concern on this build it was all about funtion and accuracy. I never really expected it to be as good as it was. I need ore horsepower now for those 1000 yard shots and much much better optics.
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  5. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1biggun View Post
    I put a reinforcement plate in inside the reciver with threaded holes
    Oh, that's an easy way to do it. The AMD handguard idea might be put into practice, I like how they look, and it would be easy to reinforce it if I needed to.

    On the extending the gas cylinder idea, look at the G36's gas system, if you have trouble with the pressure in the cylinder holding the bolt open while the bolt is closing. It has a really cool idea for gas relief that vents it out the front after a delay of a set amount of piston movement. Here's a pic, it would also probably run cleaner than the standard AK gas system.

    You could simplify it a lot,

    Gas piston is in blue for clarity. Thinking about it it would also be a lot better for if you shoot corrosive ammo, then the salts are vented forward, no having to clean the carrier or bolt [so long as there isn't primer leakage] You could even put some gas sealing rings on the piston, kind of like on an AR bolt.

  6. #56
    No Hope For Me 1biggun's Avatar
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    that interesting

    who ever cleans there bolt LOL. I dont have any proplems with function but is does make me wonder if my action is closing as hard as it could now.

  7. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1biggun View Post
    who ever cleans there bolt LOL.
    Well, with corrosive it would be a plus, but I guess with .223 it wouldn't matter much.
    You shouldn't have trouble with pressure build up on bolt closing if you have a standard setup, but the longer cylinder fitted to the piston might give you troubles. Heck, it slowing the closing might be good. Less jarring to mess up your zero. So long as it reliably chambers ammo...

  8. #58
    No Hope For Me 1biggun's Avatar
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    it chambers fine but Im wondering if it might have the return stroke slowed down. I have been considering a build with a tighter chamber and head space. with that comes a tighterfitting rounds. if I was getting a slower return stroke it might not close the bolt on a close tolerance round. Id like to try fireformed ammo with only the necks resized like the bench rest boys and that takes some pressure on the round. I have been considering trying it in singleshot mode to see if its worth it in better accuracy. it would help save brass and increase life.

  9. #59
    No Hope For Me 1biggun's Avatar
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    Bump for updates and info .
    what do you want to know?? I havent been building much as a new job is taking up a lot of time.

    I have been playing with a Idea were the top of carrier is allowed to make contact with the RSB right at lock up this will force the bolt carrier assembly to be tight only at the point of lock up and still allow it to run loose when cycling. right now im playing with it in conjunction to tapered rails and tight tollerance bolt to carrer fit and doing it by adding a slight amount of weld to the carrier. I am considering a spring loaded wedge that would allow a little more forgiving chamber and an ammo tolerances. Im thinking as the bolt begins to lock a spring loaded wedge built into the RSB will force the carrier down removing any up and down play.

    ANY THING THAT REMOVES THE BLAY FROM THE BOLT WHEN THE ACTION IS CLOSED SHOLD IMPROVE ACCURACY.

    THERE IS A 6MM-284 LONG RANGE BUILD IN THE WORKS BUT ITS LIKELY GOING TO TAKE A YEAR TO GET IT DONE AS FREE TIME IS A BIG ISSUE. hAVING ENOUGH TIME TO SHOOT AND WORK UP LOADS AND BE ABLE TO DO TESTING THAT SHOWS GAINS OR LOSES IS A BATTEL AS WELL. ONCE YOU GET DOWN TO UNDER 1/2"ITS HARD TO DETERMINE WHATS HELPING OR HURTING UNLESS ITS REPATABLE AND PROVABLE. TO MUCH GUESSIING IF THE AMMO OR WIND IT A ISSUE WHEN YOUR TRYING TO SHAVE OFF A 1/16 OF INCH OF A SMALL GROUP. ITS GETTING WERE THE GUN SHOOTS BETTER THAN i CAN AN THEN YOU START NEEDING BETTER OPTICS AND OTHER STUFF.

  10. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1biggun View Post
    I have been playing with a Idea were the top of carrier is allowed to make contact with the RSB right at lock up this will force the bolt carrier assembly to be tight only at the point of lock up
    I tightened the gas piston all the way down on my yugo build and it is tight in the gas cylinder, but the gas tube is loose, so the piston can rattle around a bit when the bolt is back, but when it's forward the bolt carrier is a file fit to the receiver.

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