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Thread: Legalities of building a full-auto MG

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    GuncoHolic yosuthnmasa's Avatar
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    Default Legalities of building a full-auto MG

    I have heard talk about paying the $200 tax and filling out the paperwork to build a full-atuo AK in some states. This would be considered "manufacturing" a MG and requires the Class 3 paperwork. Can someone give me some firsthand experience with this and the legalities of it. I am very interested in owning a MG for collection and investment purposes. Any info. would be greatly appreciated. I have been checking into Recguns.

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    Chief Administrator 7.62x39's Avatar
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    Josh,

    You cannot build a FA under any circumstances.
    It must have been built prior to 1986
    .

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    Gunco Veteran mike26038's Avatar
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    Well I have been hearing rumors of approved from 1s in the 9th Circut Courts jurisdiction?? But I haven't seen anyone claiming that they have one step up to bat and post a scan...
    Repeal FOPA NOW!!!!!



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    GuncoHolic yosuthnmasa's Avatar
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    Mike I heard something similar to that. I couldn't remember, though, who all was in this "area" that I remember reading in the article. If I'm not mistaken, Florida was in this Circuit. Couldn't remember if Georgia was,though. Where might one find out more about this? I've searched all over and can't find much of anything.

    What are the requirements to have the FFL that allows you to manufacture MG's legally? Is it a Class 2 FFL that allows you to do this? And if it is, who are you able to make them for? Can you make them to sell to individuals who pay the tax stamp?

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    Chief Administrator 7.62x39's Avatar
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    Being able to own one, and being able to build one, are two totally different subjects.

    The manufacture of full autos for the civilian market was banned in 86
    Since then they can only be built for Military/LEO use
    The only way you can own one is to find a transferable pre 86 model
    plan on spending $8500 to $10,000 on it.
    .

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    Master Endmill Breaker Rhino_66's Avatar
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    Yep, It's really the pits! A brand new FN P90 is only about $1300 for LE or military types...

    The 86 ban cuts off some really decent stuff and drives prices ridiculously high. I'd love to see an end to the draconian gun control bullshit.

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    Administrator sniper69's Avatar
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    I guess the transferable sten MK II I could've bought for $2500 would've been a steal. That was only a month ago. The person I know selling it is letting it go for half of what he sees them going for because of a non-original part that he had to put on there to fix a crack. Funny thing is the sten still runs excellent with the repair and if someone didn't know where the non original part was - well they probably wouldn't be able to tell. Even though I always enjoyed shooting it when he brought it to the range - I couldn't see spending that kind of cash on one gun (besides my wife wouldn't let me, lol). I think he still has it for sale.

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    GuncoHolic yosuthnmasa's Avatar
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    I've been thinking really hard lately about getting a MG for investment purposes. I've checked out Subguns.com and recguns.com and read quite a bit of material on so many different types out there. For those of you who know quite a bit about them, what would be a decent low-end (price wise) MG that looks like it is moving up in the pricing pyramid of MG's. I know that most all MG's are constantly moving up in value, but I'm looking for one that seems to be running away in price but is near the bottom of the totem pole in price now. Maybe the MAC 10's or Sten's?

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    Applied Homeland Defense saintarctangent's Avatar
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    Subguns.com has a lot of stuff about the 9th circuit court ruling. Also, you can do a google search of stewart gun appeal and you should get to the actual decision of the 9th circuit.

    Basically as I understand it, the 9th circuit said that the BATF's jurisdiction to regulate firearms only extends as far as regulating interstate commerce. Since this Stewart guy made his own machinegun from unique parts in his own machine shop, the gov't could prove he had participated in interstate commerce. Therefore, from this ruling, some have assumed that if you make your own machinegun from unique parts that you could never have gotten through interstate commerce - your legal. Now state laws are another thing. The kicker is that the feds have until 9/18 to appeal the decision to the US supreme court or the ruling stands like a law which would most likely be upheld in other districts as well. From what I can gather, the feds haven't done anything.

    I haven't heard of anyone getting an approved form 1 returned to them after the Stewart case - has anyone else?

    I've thought a lot about this and I often wonder what the decision means to the average Joe like me.

    Before the '86 law outlawing all new mg manufacture, any old Joe could just fill out the proper form, get a CLEO endorsement, fingerprints, $200 and the BATF would approve you to manufacture your own mg.

    I tell ya what - those days must have been good! I was too young then to take advantage of it. I can imagine what it must have been like to say purchase a full auto uzi, or better yet convert your own homebuilt AK!

    Did the law do anything to stop crime - yeah right! After '86, we saw the rise in the drug gangs who didn't give a hoot about filing the proper form with the BATF before they obtained approval . . .

    Does the '86 law effect the 2nd amendment? Hell yes! How can we protect ourselves from a tyranical gov't without them? Do I need a mg for self protection, probably not, but I bet if someone could ask Thomas Jefferson what kind of gun the typical American should have to exercise their 2nd amendment rights - he'd probably say a full auto AK! Old Tommy boy and friends didn't make it the 10th amendment - it was too important - they made it the 2nd!

    I do know this - if Kerry gets elected, he will be a poster child for Sarah Brady and her cult like followers like Fineswein. I imagine a Kerry administration would try to fight it tooth and nail. Maybe the BATF is just trying to hold on until after the election?

    Another thing - most guys who own pre '86 mg have no interest in having the ban repealed. They have thousands if not 10s of thousands of dollars in investments that would deflate overnight if the BATF approved form 1s. Think about it, if you had a pre ban registered M-16 and paid say $750, they're now going for about $15-20. Do they want the BATF to approve guys like me to make my own M-16 yeah right!

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    GuncoHolic yosuthnmasa's Avatar
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    So, since he wasn't involved in interstate commerce that couldn't regulate it...hmmm. Sounds really good to me. But, how then would you register the MG if you legally owned it. Kinda like a catch 22. If you didn't register it, you would be breaking the law for not having your MG registered. I'm pretty sure the other circuits have ruled against such similar situations. But, if all goes well and you live in the 9th circuit you may be able to convert your own some day. I would have to move to Florida....nice beach and MG's!

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