[spork2367]

I just got my kit back from Stan at project guns today. I say kit because in 18 weeks he failed to finish building my RPD. This was up from the initial 6-8 weeks I was told when I sent my kit in. I didn't pester him, but communicated on a regular basis to see where the progress was at. In 18 weeks I got nothing but excuse after excuse along with some flat out lies. It went from one lead time to another, then he needed my invoice number to determine lead time, then later (even after I had given him my invoice number) he couldn't tell me where my gun was at with the others, then he couldn't give me any lead time at all. Not once did he even attempt to apologize for the ridiculous lead times. In the end, he sent the kit back due to my "abuse" as he called it.
In 18 weeks he managed to do about 40 minutes worth of machining, remove the bipod from the barrel, and bead blast my parkerized DSA receiver. For everyone that still has a kit there, he is (according to him) making semi-auto parts (which are curiously listed as "in stock" on his website), which will need fitted to each of the 40 some guns he said he was making. He still needs to turn the threads off of the barrels, press and headspace them, then parkerize every gun. I would be very surprised if anyone sees a finished rifle before February. Below are all the emails Stan and I exchanged. The only communication not there is the call where I asked when my gun would be finished, he asked for my name, went on a tirade about how he didn't need my abuse (when he realized who I was), said he was sending my kit back and hung up on me.

I am a manufacturing engineer who runs a 26 person CNC job shop. I ran CNC mills for 5 years before I started running this shop. I deal with customers on a daily basis and this isn't how it's done. I sent this to Stan because I have too many projects already. Now all I have to show for it is 40 minutes of machining and 18 weeks lost. Also, if you are on a few of the other gun building forums excuse the cross posting. I want anyone who might be inclined to deal with Stan to know the facts before they send a kit to him.

From: Thad
To: Stan
Date: Wednesday, July 27, 2011, 11:25 AM

I just saw that you are working on some builds. I have a parts kit and DSA receiver and wondered if I could still get in on this. The barrel is already out of the old receiver section. Please let me know as I can send it out ASAP. Thanks. (I do have a weaponeer semi-auto parts kit as well if needed)

Thad Temple


From: Stan
To: Thad
Date: Wednesday, July 27, 2011, 1:22 PM

Hi,
send it, I don't use the wise lite semi parts . be sure to put your name, address and phone # in the box

Stan


From: Thad
To: Stan
Date: Wednesday, July 28, 2011, 9:44 AM

It's going out UPS today. What is your approximate lead time? Thanks.

Thad Temple


From: Stan
To: Thad
Date: Wednesday, July 28, 2011, 11:15 PM

Hi
6-8 weeks
Stan


From: Stan
To: Thad
Date: Sunday, August 07, 2011 12:47 PM

Hi,
invoice for your rpd build is attached.
Stan


From: Thad
To: Stan
Date: Monday, August 8, 2011, 8:02 AM

When should I send the money, and how
do you prefer payment? Thanks.

Thad Temple


From: Stan
To: Thad
Date: Monday, August 08, 2011 9:33 AM

HI,
i WILL CALL WHEN THE GUN IS DONE FOR PAYMENT, YOU CAN PAY BY CC, CHECK OR MO STAN


From: Thad
To: Stan
Date: Wednesday, August 31, 2011, 12:09 PM

Just thought I'd shoot you
an email to see if you had an idea of what the ship date on these is
looking like. Thanks.

Thad Temple


From: Stan
To: Thad
Date: Monday, August 31, 2011 3:00 PM

sept or oct depending on your inv #


From: Thad
To: Stan
Date: Wednesday, August 31, 2011, 3:18 PM

INV: 1166


From: Thad
To: Stan
Date: Tuesday, September 27, 2011, 3:14 PM

Invoice 1166. Just curious as to where you are at with mine. Just want to make sure the funds are ready when the gun is. Thanks.

Thad Temple


From: Stan
To: Thad
Date: Monday, September 28, 2011, 9:49 AM

Hi,
I am maching internals now, it will be about 4 weeks.
Stan


From: Thad
To: Stan
Date: Thursday, October 13, 2011 10:00 AM

I'd like to have this by Friday the 28th, is that going to be possible? Thanks.

Thad Temple


From: Stan
To: Thad
Date: Monday, October 17, 2011 9:34 AM

Hi,
I am building over 40 guns, it won't be ready by then.
Stan


From: Thad
To: Stan
Date: Monday, October 17, 2011 1:47 PM

I just saw that you were away at Knob Creek. I understand the quantity of guns you're are dealing with. I'm a manufacturing engineer at a large CNC job shop. I sent this to you because I just didn't have time to work on it. I'd just like some sort of date. Originally I was told 6-8 weeks. Then I was told another 4 weeks after that time was up. Right now we're working on 11 weeks and you're telling me that it won't be done in 12 weeks. Any idea on a realistic ETA?

Thad Temple


From: Stan
To: Thad
Date: Tuesday, October 18, 2011 4:36 PM

Hi,
can't give a date, I don't know how many guns are ahead of you.
Stan


From: Thad
To: Stan
Date: Wednesday, November 9, 2011 3:09 PM

I've been pretty patient with your delays. So have a lot of other people that I've talked to who are waiting for their builds. I would like your best guess as to when my RPD may be done. My invoice number is 1166. Thanks.

Thad Temple


From: Stan
To: Thad
Date: Friday, November 11, 2011 8:43 AM

I am building 45 of these at once, it takes time, I want them done asap as it is pay day for me when they ship.


From: Thad
To: Stan
Date: Friday, November 11, 2011 8:48 AM

That isn't a good enough answer. You've already told me this, and honestly, it isn't my problem as a customer that you took on more work than you could handle. It also isn't my fault as a customer that you chose to move your shop after taking on this many builds. Maybe I have less sympathy for you because I run a CNC shop with 26 employees and 35 machines and deal with this all day long.

I want an estimate in weeks. Before Thanksgiving, after Thanksgiving, before Christmas...I want something to go by. After almost 14 weeks, they ought to be close, and being that you've built these before, you ought to have a pretty good idea.

Thad


From: Stan
To: Thad
Date: Friday, November 11, 2011 11:55 AM

I moved and invested in bigger better equipment to get work out faster. I can't give you a delivery date, but I can send your kit back if you can't wait.


From: Thad
To: Stan
Date: Friday, November 11, 2011 12:02 PM

I don't want a half finished kit back with 14 weeks of time I could have been working on it lost. I'm still baffled as to how you can't give me any sort of date at all. This is especially annoying at a price of 875.00 which is a premium price for the amount of machine work and parts that are included. I even went to the trouble of removing my barrel from the receiver stub before sending it. At this point I'd have a hard time recommending your build services on any of the half a dozen gun forums I'm on.

Thad Temple


From: Thad
To: Stan
Date: Friday, December 01, 2011 8:15 AM

Stan,

Is this going to be done before or after Christmas? I'm actually going to be in Florida during Christmas, and in Honduras for a mission trip the 5-15 of January. It's gone from 6-8 weeks to 17 weeks now. I really don't give a shit at this point, I just need to know so I can make some plans.


From: Thad
To: Stan
Date: Friday, December 8, 2011 9:36 AM

18 weeks now. I don't care what your situation is, I expect an email back in a timely manner unless you are literally working 24 hours a day or you're dead. Before or after Christmas?


From: Stan
To: Thad
Date: Friday, December 09, 2011 10:39 AM

the guns are being built, it will be after christmas. thanks for your your kind words


From: Stan
To: Thad
Date: Friday, December 09, 2011 11:11 AM

I decided I don't need your abuse, so I am sending your kit back


From: Thad
To: Stan
Date: Friday, December 9, 2011 12:20 PM

Stan,

First off, below it the email you referenced on the phone. I did not, as you stated, say that I didn't care if you were dead. I said that would be an acceptable excuse as to why you couldn't respond to an email in over a week. In the 18 weeks you've had this kit, I could have sent it to one of 5 other guys to have it finished but I decided to stick it out with you since you had time into it. If you send my kit back unfinished, I'll be posting this entire email chain along with everything that has transpired on every online forum I'm on. I've already found two threads online about people currently waiting for their RPD's and several people who have RPD's that you built who are having problems that you don't seem interested in fixing. I would prefer that you finish the gun. If you finish it, I'll pay you and our business will be done. If you send me back a half machined parts kit, I guarantee you will lose a serious amount of business. If I don't hear from you by tomorrow afternoon I'll assume that you aren't concerned about losing business.


From: Thad
To: Stan
Date: Friday, December 9, 2011 1:12 PM

Stan,

I changed my mind, go ahead and send my kit back. I would rather people know about how you do business. I wish someone would have told me ahead of time that as far as Project Guns is concerned, Stan is always right, the customer isn't. Funny, when you read back through all the emails there isn't one apology from you for this grossly excessive wait time. I know now that you're telling other people with RPD kits you're building that you're waiting on semi auto parts even though your website states that they are in stock. I just don't trust you at this point. Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me.