View Full Version : FAC Policy: Charge Extra Shipping on Back Orders
08-04-2004, 09:26 PM
Recently, I placed an order for three items from FAC. Two were in stock, shipped - and I was charged for shipping.
Today, the BO'd item arrived with - guess what? - an additional shipping charge - 17% of the value of the $27 part.
I phoned FAC to determine their official policy on shipping & BO'd items. According to FAC, full shipping is charged on items in stock, followed by ADDITIONAL "minimal shipping" on BO'd items.
From my experience, every other company I have dealt with has shipped BO'd items without shipping charges, realizing that they are the ones that have chosen to stock a certain level of product - a business decision that you, the customer, does not get to vote on.
Be warned: FAC has a reputation for advertising items that are not in stock - and, should you order from them, your costs may be far higher than indicated by Web Invoice. I would suggest that you seek out the actual source of these products, and order from those that actually make and have them.
Should Harlen wish to reply to the situation? Invoice number B07043904. No, I don't want any money back - simply state, in public, your policy on backorder shipping costs.
08-05-2004, 02:59 AM
well that bones... and they will NOT hold the parts in stock till the BO parts show up so they may run out of what they do have awaiting the BO. so even if you are willing to wate for the BO stuff you still will not definatly get everything on one shipping charge. just cant win sometimes
08-05-2004, 09:29 AM
That does seem unusual. As you stated most suppliers do not charge shipping on back orders.
That doesn't seem right.
Harlan at FAC
08-05-2004, 11:34 AM
We do charge for S/H on back ordered items. I can see that customers who use the internet ordering system would not be aware of this. I will bring up this topic during upcoming management meetings, and see what better notice can be made available to any potential customer.
In the meantime, is anyone aware of other companies who charge S/H for back ordered items?
08-05-2004, 05:35 PM
Most companies do not charge shipping on B/O items unless this is the only item ordered. If part of the item is shipped the shipping charge would usually cover the item B/Od if it had all been shipped together. If the item B/Od would increase the shipping charge then the difference in the shipping charge would be appropiate.
Example if shipping would normally be $10 for all items and one item is B/Od that item would ship w/o any additional charge.
If shipping would have been $15 for all items and the original shipping charge was $10 then it would be appropiate to charge the difference on the B/O item (ie $5).
I usually order from the company that charges the least on shipping. I save hundreds of dollars on not ordering items because I don't want to pay shipping. Shipping is a part of the cost of the item. I am not going to pay $8+ dollars shipping on a $12 dollar item. I have had companies that have charged me that kind of shipping ONCE then I don't do business with them again. I would rather wait till the next show or group my orders before I will pay high shipping charges. Companies that look at shipping as a profit center loose more business than they can imagine. If you lower your rates or offer specials on free/reduced shipping your business will grow.
08-05-2004, 09:04 PM
I once received a split order from IO, they did not charge me extra shipping on the BO item.
I also had similiar situations with Centerfire, had to make special arrangement with Tapco, but they did it for me
08-05-2004, 10:10 PM
Maybe I don't understand at all. If I order something that is suppose to be in stock, and I later find out that it is backordered and am charged an extra percentage because it is B/O, I am going to be pissed. It isn't my fault that it wasn't stocked, and now I have to wait longer and pay an extra fee. IMO they should give you a discount when something is backordered and it takes longer to get there.
However, I do agree with falshooter's statement concerning a split order. If your total shipping for all items is $15.00, and $10 is applied for the first package and $5 for the backordered item, fine. Or, the entire shipping is $5 and it is charged up front and the backordered item is sent later. It isn't sent free because it was covered with the initial shipping.
But, I don't think it would be right, to charge $10 for the first items that are in stock, and then charge $5 + 17% for the B/O item.
If this happened to me, I WOULD find someone else to buy from. I have never dealt with FAC, but there are many companies out there that have really worked with me.
08-05-2004, 11:18 PM
KVAR has never charged any of my back orders on a split delivery
08-06-2004, 12:36 AM
HARLAN everything else aside..... IT IS REALY GOOD to see you post here!!!!! I think now is the time to and here is the place to tell EVERYONE about my customer service story of FAC. I will be as short as I can, I bought a part it did not fit as I expected it would. FAC did more that I ever would have thought to be shure I was satisfied. the part is still on the gun and it is fine due to FAC going the extra mile for me. this is the very short version.... end result... I order from them again and this post for everyone to read. they are all rite in my book.
Harlen said he would bring it up in a group, then I can take him at his word. then the group can deside what they wnat to do. MY OPPINION is at very least the policy will be cleary notisable so the customer can decide. maby some of the suggestions here will be mentioned at the meeting. but that is up to them what they want to do.
I know I am rambeling BUT they HONESTLY went above and beyond for me. NO joke.
08-06-2004, 05:34 AM
I don't order more than once from companies that use S&H as a means of increasing their profit margin. A good example is joeken in Arizona. I ordered an AK receiver from them for $32.00(a while back) didn't think to ask what shipping was. Very shocked to see that they charged $13 for S&H. Took the package back to UPS and asked what the true shipping charge was---less than $4! Haven't dealt with Joking since!!!
08-06-2004, 09:04 AM
OJF, You are lucky, at least you got something from them.
Most of JK's orders seem to fall into a abyss, right after they charge your CC.
I have ordered from FAC a few times with positive results, the items I ordered were in stock, so I have never run into a BO shipping situation with them.
All in all I have been pleased with my dealings with them, but I have never run into a problem with a order, which is good, but that's when you really find out what type of company you are dealing with.
HB's experience with them is encouraging though, they came through for him.
Harlan at FAC
08-06-2004, 12:34 PM
I have reviewed the order to which 'trotsky' referred. The total for S/H on the two shipments was about the same as if all the items were in stock at time of order, and could have been shipped in one shipment.
It is not our intention to penalize customers because of a back order situation. S/H is added to each ship-out, but the S/H charges are prorated, based on the items shipping under each invoice. The staff involved in processing invoices pays special attention to situations where S/H appears high (S/H is calculated by computer software), and manually reduces to a lesser amount.
Shipping and handling charges are not used as a profit center. S/H expenses includes much more than actual shipping charges.
If you as a customer ever has a question or request as to S/H charges, please call either Sandy at 800-486-5971x113 or Sue at 800-486-5971x104. They will help you.
I respect 'trotsky' for bringing up his situation. What it shows is that we can do a better job of communicating back to the customer in the internet shopping cart experience. Real time inventory status and real time calculation of actual S/H charges are improvements as short term goals.
08-06-2004, 12:48 PM
Don't worry about joeken, I don't think they are going be in business for long, I had order few recivers from them, My dealer send the M.O to Joeken, and JoeKen never send out the order and took the money. well let's said my dealer know few ATF and FBI guys in D.C . Joeken is getting something they should it get a long time ago.
08-06-2004, 02:38 PM
I would like to second my support for FAC. I have had dealing with them in the past and they have always gone above and beyond.
In my earlier post I was discussing buying decisions in general terms. We all do a lot of ordering and it is almost always cheaper to get it from an individual or at a show. When you have something shipped from a company you have a lot of additional factors that increase the cost of shipping. Some companies use thoes factors as a profit center and some simply have higher overhead. All I was stating above is I take all of those factors into consideration when I place an order. I look at total cost of putting that item in my hand and if I decide that number is acceptable I will place the order with the company that has the lowest final number. When a company does a free shipping special my orders go up. When the cost including shipping is equal/close to the cost of getting it locally I will get it locally.
08-06-2004, 05:00 PM
Thank you for the update.
I really believe that FAC is one of the "good guy's"
My avoid at all costs list only has two names on it, JoeKen and Sarco
I think that all the rest really do try to come through for us.
I would not hesitate to do business with FAC, Centerfire, Tapco, Global they are all good people.
But the king of them all has to be Brownell's.
Between my own stuff, fellow club members (2 clubs) and my hunting and shooting buddy's I end up working on all types of firearms, some of which are fairly old and/or obscure, but every time I'm looking for some oddball pin, spring or clip, Brownell's has it in stock.
And every time I place an order with them, it is shipped and a tracking number sent within hours, I just don't know how they do it.
08-06-2004, 06:13 PM
Aren't they outfitted in some podunk little town too?
I definitely didn't understand what happened here, and spoke too soon.