View Full Version : Simplest Pistol
01-28-2009, 10:22 PM
Hello everyone, I'm looking to get into gun smithing / building. I have a 3 axis cnc mill equiped with 3d cad cam software "bobcad 22" and want to start my gun building experience off with a pistol. What I'd like to know is what would be a good pistol for me to make? Just to let you know I have never done any gun smithing at all, but am a quick learner. When I say what would be a good pistol to start off making I mean what is the simplest, most straight forward. I saw a single shot 22 on ThompsonMachine.net, but he did'nt give any specs or anything and I thought that looked like that could be a good project. So if anyone has any ideas/ info I'd be much appreciative and any info on prints and such is also totally welcome, THANKS!
01-28-2009, 11:14 PM
panaceabeachbum is a very talented builder.
01-29-2009, 01:32 AM
Looks like your off to a great start with that machinery,I only wish I had it. For now I'll have to do as I always have and do it the ''Afgan way'', by hand. Ive been thinking of a simple blow back pistol using a piece of ak bbl,chamber it for 7.62x25 w/ a ar 15 trigger group. Make my frame from square tubeing and a square bolt from barstock, both from 4130 steel,kinda look like a m9-11 w/ mag well forward of the trigger guard. I would try something more ambitious with machinery tho.Scan the posts here and maybe youll find something that these guys have done.They will help you anyway they can as they have me on several occasions. Good luck!
01-30-2009, 12:33 AM
Thanks for the recomendation, I will have to contact him and se if he'll give me some ideas.
01-30-2009, 12:48 AM
Mtdew what I want to do is make the majority of the gun myself. Your idea still sounds very interesting, but you say it to me like I've made guns before. So what your saying take a barrel from a ak and the innerds of a ar15 and billed a frame from square tubing and so on. So how tight do the tolerances have to be when building a gun? I need more directions on something like that, for my level of knowledge of this. Maybe I'm over complicating it, but I like to have some sort of reassurance that I have some kind of idea of what to do.
01-30-2009, 12:56 AM
My idea for a first build, now this is comming from someone who doesn't know anything really about the subject. Would be a simple 1 shot pistol, that I'd machine the frame and make a barrel. Also machine all the mechanical pieces of it too. Well as much as possible. I seen the guy that has thompson machine. net made a little .22 pistol that I stated above in 3 days. Something like that I'd think would give me a good chunk of experience. But maybe it would be better to first do a build from mostly pre existing pieces.
01-30-2009, 01:00 AM
You say you wish you had a cnc, you should look up machinery auctions. They are all over, shops are going out of buissness left and right. These are big shops too, with a whole bunch of machinery. I'm not trying to come accross like this is a good thing in no means, but you can come up on hell of alot of good deals if you look. We constantly get fliers in the mail from auctioneers such as Ashmans and a few others that don't come to mind.
01-30-2009, 01:40 AM
panaceabeachbum is a very talented builder.
+1 on that, and he is usually more than willing to help others out.
01-30-2009, 08:20 PM
"Make a bbl" is a little involved for most people, even with the machinery to build everything else. A rifling machine is needed, a rather specialized piece of equipment that is used only in the bbl making process. Panaceabeachbum used a bbl liner in his project pistol, with an overtube to stiffen and reinforce it. Normally used to sleeve a shot out original bbl, they are available from Brownells and are usually just glued into a drilled out bbl or tube. Replacing the bbl on a 10/22 with a heavy weight one seems to be done on at least half of the Rugers sold these days, Ebay usually has a dozen or more factory ones up for auction on any given day. These often go for $10 or $15 and give you 16+ inches of useable bbl. that can be cut and/or turned to fit something else. A .22 chamber reamer would be required if you use a piece without a chamber, of course, but a serviceable one can be made out of drill rod.
On guns, tolerances are generally pretty wide from a safety standpoint, with the exception of headspace. On something low pressure like a .22 there isn't much danger from a blown case, but centerfire stuff can cause some real damage. Generally, on moving parts the wider the clearances between them the more reliable they are as dirt can cake in there and still allow movement. As you tighten things up accuracy generally increases but reliability goes down as the tighter spaces can get jammed with smaller amounts of dirt. Take the Colt 1911 pistol. A half worn out military relic from WWII will still safely shoot just fine yet it rattles when you shake it. A modern target version that has been customized for max accuracy will have no discernable movement between the parts. Both function safely, the accurized one will shoot tighter groups but has to be kept clean. The relic might have trouble hitting the broad side of a barn from the inside, but it can also be drug through a muddy foxhole and still function.
As long as you are not going into production with interchangeable parts required, one-off guns can be hand fitted with no problem. Take a bit too much off the frame rails? Just make the bolt/slide wider to compensate. The "spec" doesn't matter because you are making the mating piece to fit what you have, not what it "should" be.
Panaceabeachbum's pistol is about as simple as it gets, although one could dispense with the sliding breechblock and simply unscrew the bbl from a solid breech to load and unload. Not as quick, but simpler to make. Just look at the photos of the pistol on his website and you should be able to figure out how to build something similar. Unless you want your parts to interchange with his, no need for prints at all.
01-30-2009, 09:12 PM
Thank you for your time and knowledge. I will give that try and take your advice on making my own bbl. I am better off starting off slow. Thank you again for your input it is very appreciated.
01-31-2009, 01:06 AM
Right now gun parts/numrich has off center 24" octagon barrel blanks for $10 its part number TD1135340 Welcome to Numrich Gun Parts Corp. (http://www.e-gunparts.com) If you wanted to make a pistol barrel from it and turned it between centers you should be fine, and for that price you'll probably pay more in shipping for it.
01-31-2009, 06:22 PM
Thanks moleman, more information and sources the better. I was on ebay and saw no gun bbl., I typed in gun bbl. and gun parts and did'nt see any bbl. Thanks again moleman I appreciate all the help I can get.
01-31-2009, 08:14 PM
Wow, 6 months ago you couldn't do a search for "Ruger" without at least 2-3 OEM 10/22 bbls and stocks per page of results. Now, all I could find under "barrel" was a shotgun and a muzzleloader. Looks like people are hanging on to everything these days!
01-31-2009, 08:26 PM
Ebay got full of its self about a year ago and further restricted gun related items. If its anything that you need to make a gun fire you can't sell it anymore. So no bolts barrels triggers ect... At the time I was selling a lot of brass on ebay and It pissed me off that they were restricting items that anyone can buy. I get a chuckle every time I see a garand "tube" or "unknown part" that sure looks like a barrel. I sold a few "AR15 rear sight towers" on there that I would of normally listed as an upper receiver except it would violate their rules.
01-31-2009, 08:36 PM
Yup, no brass, bullets. Lumps of inert metal until assembled and chambered. But PeeBay won't allow them.
01-31-2009, 09:18 PM
Hillaries hairy ass, thats a funny video. That is another funny but true, more then half of America are complete ASSs.
02-02-2009, 10:27 PM
i guess a muzzle-loading smooth bore pistol is about the absolute simplest. you could feasably make all parts even the bbl safely as long as you use decent steel w/ plenty of wall thickness but i dont know if this would meet your criteria for your project.
02-02-2009, 11:56 PM
Well I really don't have much of a criteria, it's more of just a starting/ learning project.
02-02-2009, 11:57 PM
I have I question, someone who I don't know asked me through a add I put on craigslist if I could finish a 80% ar15 receiver for them. I can legally do this right?
02-03-2009, 12:06 AM
No. You can let them borrow your machine tools, but they would have to do the actual machining. Making a receiver for someone else would require an FFL.
02-03-2009, 04:12 PM
Verry much appreciated, I wasn't sure. I just put a add up to do machine work on craigslist, then the 2nd email I received was from some guy who knows who looking to get some ar15 receivers milled. Most likely he is looking for someone who would be gullable enough to do it for him, again thank you verry much for the info.