View Full Version : Bolt-action rifles.
08-12-2012, 11:32 AM
I've looked around but don't see much in the way of bolt-action posts.
I packed an M-24 for a while and am currently building an M40 look-alike.
I haven't run across much in the way of posts for accurized ("sniper" for want of a better term) rifles. Does GUNCO.net have a section I've so far missed?
A lot of the "Sniper" forums I've run across seem to be mostly war stories. Good info on scopes and actions might serve some of us better.
Often, all the rounds-per-minute in the world doesn't replace one well-placed shot.
08-12-2012, 04:11 PM
I would like to see a bolt action section. I think most posts about them get put here in the general section.
08-12-2012, 05:59 PM
Yeah mtdew; I looked around. "Battle Rifles" has two lonely posts. The rest is kinda hit and miss. A section on accurate single-shot or bolt-actions might have some pretty good threads once it got going.
Granted, hosing down an area is impressive; but nothing says 'nowhere-to-hide' like pin-point accuracy.
08-12-2012, 06:04 PM
The 98 Mauser is the best all around bolt action rifle when you consider it's combination of accuracy, reliability, ease of maintenance and safety IMHO!
08-12-2012, 07:23 PM
Accurizing a bolt action comes down to "blueprinting" everything, smoothing up everything, hand lapping the bolt lugs, and installing a high dollar match grade bbl with a match spec chamber, then properly bedding it in a good synthetic or metal skeleton stock. That requires a lathe and other specialty tools, which is why hobbyists are not into them too much.
08-12-2012, 09:20 PM
True, kernel. Accurizing a line weapon involves a lot.
On the other hand, I just bought a Remington SPS-Tactical. So I've got a better than average action, trigger group and barrel out of the box. I got rid of the Hogue Overmolded joke in favor of an M40 stock. A good scope to top everything and I'm off to the range.
I may just be 'parts swapping' in some people's eyes, but isn't that what a lot of "builds" are?
Tommo's right. Some weapons are better than others for overall accuracy, 'feel' and dependable function and performance under field conditions. Don't know what makes the difference but it's there.
08-12-2012, 11:38 PM
I looked around. "Battle Rifles" has two lonely posts. You need to go to the bottom of the page/threads and change it from "this month" to "from the beginning" (or something like that), there's 16 pages of threads with 20 threads per page in the Battle Rifles area. It's like this in every section.
08-13-2012, 12:18 AM
I tried your suggestion and all kinds of stuff opened up. This'll keep me reading for a month.
08-13-2012, 01:28 AM
Your welcome. It took me a while to find that when I first joined
08-13-2012, 01:34 AM
I am glad this subject came up. I have been building Mausers for many years now. I am transitioning to Savage Rifles for a number of reasons now.
I will take some time to read and put up some quality posts to get the pump primed.
08-13-2012, 03:39 AM
Welcome to the forum.. Bolt action..
Poor guy does not even have sights on his weapon..
"White Death" :)
Battle rifle- Old beat up Mosin Nagant..
"Ensconced in the snow, his white camouflage suit rendering him invisible to the invading Soviet soldiers he stalked, Simo Häyhä steadied himself to fire. During the 1939–1940 Winter War, in temperatures as low as –40 °C, the Finnish sniper undertook a killing spree that saw him single-handedly take the lives of at least 700 men in less than 100 days. Over 500 of these he shot using a standard, bolt-action rifle with non-telescopic sights. Is it any wonder he earned the nickname White Death among his enemies? Meet the man who would take Rambo to the cleaners"
Read more at White Death: the Sniper Who Killed 700 Soviets in 100 Days (http://www.environmentalgraffiti.com/featured/white-death-simo-hayh/20951#Jt5Oy98AwVZ3cA7z.99)
08-13-2012, 11:49 AM
hey man theres an amazing forum called snipershide.com they have a regular forum section with some seriously knowledgable guys on there that talk about the loophole formula like its no biggy. there are alot of guys on there that are serious gear snobs that dont think twice about spending 10 grand on a scope but theres also alot of really useful builds that are somewhat budget minded. also if you have a paid membership you have access to snipers hide videos in which they teach you how to read wind, track targets on the move, shoot from a raised platform, and even advanced rifle cleaning.
08-13-2012, 12:18 PM
I haven't run across much in the way of posts for accurized ("sniper" for want of a better term) rifles. Does GUNCO.net have a section I've so far missed?
HMMMM WELL SINCE ONLU ABOUT .0005% OF THE READERS WILL EVER SHOT A RIFLE FOR THE PURPOSE OF BEING A SNIPER IT MIGHT BE BETTER TO CALL IT A TARGET RIFLE. IN TRUTH THATS WHAT IT IS EVEN TRUE SNIPER RIFLES SHOT BY SNIPERS SELDOM GET SHOT AT PEOPLE. IN FACT IN THE USA LEO SNIPER RIFLES LIKELY EVER GET SHOT AT ON A REAL HUMAN. THERE A TARGET RIFLE WITH A FEW DOD ADS TO MAKE THEM BETTER SUITED FOR SHOOTING FROM NON TRADITIONL BENCHES.
PERSONALY CALLING A BOLT ACTION RIFLE A SNIPER RIFLE LEAVES A BAD TASTE IN MY MOUTH. ITS WHAT THE GUN GRABBERS WILL BE GOING AFTER THEY GET ALL THE ASSULT WEAPONS OUT OUR HANDS.
IT STIKES ME AS FUNNY THAT MOST OF TODAYS SNIPER RIFLES IN 308 OR 300 MG ARE BASED ON HUNTING RIFLE ACTIONS OR MODIFICATIONS OF THEM. OF COURSE THOSE DESIGNS ARE BASED OF A LOT OF MAUSER DESIGNS. ITS SORT OF A WEIRD CIRCLE OF EVOLUTION. A DESIGN MADE TO BE A BATTEL RIFEL IS TAKEN REFINED TO BE A BETTER HUNTING RIFLE OR TARGET RIFLE AN THEN THOSE REFINEMETNS ARE USED TO MAKE IT A BETTER PEOPLE SHOOTER.
THERE IS NOTHING REALLY DIFFERANT ASIDE FROM TRIGGER PULL AN BARREL WEIGHT THAN A REALLY GOOD HUNTING RIFLE. SOMETHING MANY US SNPIER RILFES ACTUALY WERE IN THE BEGINING. ESPECALY INTHE 1960,S
THERE ARE SPECIAL SCOPES BUT THERE NOTHING MORE THAN A TARGET SCOPE WITH MAYBE A LITTLE HEAVIER CONSTRUCTIONS AN SOME EXTRA DOTS INTHE CROSS HAIRS.
THERE ARE LOTS OF SIGHTS ABOUT BOLT ACTION RIFLES AN MAKING THEM ACCURATE.
LOOK A BENCHREST CENTRAL FOR EXAMPLE. THOSE GUYS ARE SHOOTING SUB 1/2" GROUPS AT 300 YARDA AN FURTHER. THEY GET INTO SUCH TECHNICAL STUFF IT MAKES YOUR HEAD SPIN.
THERE IS WEAPONS GUILD, GREAY BEARDS, A FEW MILITARY GUN SITES.
GUNCO IS HERE TODAY IMO BECAUSE 8 YEARS AGO IT WAS THE PLACE TO LEARN HW TO MAKE A PILE OF AK PARTS GO BANG.
SINCE BUILDING HAS DIED DOWN THANKS TO THE INTERNET AN SITES LIKE THIS MAKING IT EASY AN MAKING DEMAND HIGHER THUS DRIVING UP PRICES AN REDUCING AVALIABLE PARTS , GUNCO HAS SLOWLY BEGAN TO SLOW TO A CRAWL. 8 YEARS AGO OR SO THERE WOULD BE AT LEAST 10 TIMES THE ACTIVITY HERE. MAINY INTHE BUILD IT YOUR SELF AREAS. NOW A LOT OF THE SITE IS IN THE GENERAL DISCUSSION BITCHING ABOUT THE PRESIDENT, GOVERMENT, COPS OR WHAT EVER.
THERE IS NOTHING NEW ABOUT LATELY ABOUT BOLT ACTIONS ITS ALL BEEN DONE TO A POINT. THERE ARE NO CHEAP ACTIONS THAT ARE ANY GOOD TO PLAY WITH.
IF YOU WANT TO BUILD A BOLT ACTION YOU TRUE THE RECIVER, BUY AN OR TURN A BARREL BLANK, BED A GOOD STOCK AN ADD A SCOPE RAIL. ITS ALOMST IMPOSSABLE TO BUILD A MAUSER OR OTHER ACTION CHEAPER TO OUT SHOOT A $400 SAVAGE BOLT ACTION RIGHT OUT OF THE BOX.
THE REMINGTON 700 IS THE SMALL BLOCK CHEVY OF THE GUN WORLD. THERE ARE MORE PARTS AND UPGRADES AN WAYS TO TRICK THEM OUT THAN ANY OTHER BOLT ACTION IN THE WORLD. THEY WERE THE ACTION TO USE IN BENCH REST FOR MANY YEARS AN STILL ARE USED SOME AFTER CUSTOM HEAVIER ACTIONS HAVE NOW REPLACED THEM. THE REMIONGTON 700 WAS DESIGNED TO BE A GOOD HUNTING RIFLE IT RPLEACE THE 721 TYPE RILFE THAT WERE ALMOST IDENTICAL.
PERSONALY ID TAKE A WINCHESTER PRE 69 M70 ANY DAY OVER A M700.
THE M700 WAS CHEAPER SO ITS WHAT GUYS MESSED WITH ( JUST LIKE THE CHEVY)
IM NOT REALLY SURE HOW MUCH BETTER THE SPS TATICAL IS OVER A PLAIN JANE 700 VARMIT RIFLE AS FAR A TRIGGER, ACTION , OR BARREL. IS THE BARREL HAMMER FORGED CRAP OR DO THEY SELL YOU ABTTER BARREL NOW ON THE SPS ????
EVER NOTICE HOW MANY HEAVY TATICAL SNIPER BARREL ARE ON GUN BROKER??? LIKLEY BECAUSE ITS THE FIRST THING THAT GOES ON A TRUE SNIPER RILFE.
IMO SAVAGE SELLS THE BEST BARREL ON A OUT OF THE BOX RIFLE UNDER $600. YOUR GOING TO NEED TO PAY ALMOST DOUBLE TO GET A MORE ACCURATE GUN THAN THE SAVAGE. I SHOOT VARMINT AN EVERY GUY A GO WITH HAS AT LEAST ONE SAVAGE 223 OR 22-250 AN THEY ALL OUT SHOOT ANY OF THE MORE EXPENSIVE REMINGTON VARMINT RIFLES. WHATS INTERSTING TO ME IS THE SAVAGE HAS A FLOATING BOLT HEAD THAT ALLOWS THE CHAMBER TO DO ALL THE WORK IN POSITIONING THE ROUND. IT GOES AGASINST MOST TARGET RIFLE WISDOM. IMO IT WORKS BECAUSE ALL THE OTHER GUNS ARE NOT MADE VERY WELL TO BGINE WITH AN A TIGHT NON TRUED A BULE PRINTED ACTION WITH A TIGHT BOLT ACTUALY CAUSE MORE ISSUES THAN THE SOLVE. IMO IF YOUR GOING TO HAVE A REMIGTON OR OTHER SET UP THE BOLT HAS TO BE IN PERFECT ALGIGNMENT WITHTE CHAMBER AN ON A PRODUCTION GUN ITS SIMPLY NOT GOING TO HAPPEN. SO EVEN THOUGH A FLOATING HEAD WILL NOT GIVE YOU NECH REST ACCURACY IT WILL OUT DO A IMPERFECT NO FLOATING BOLT GUN. IMO IT BASICALY TAKES THE ACTION OUT OF THE EQUATON OTHER THAN TO HOLD THE SCOPE. SAVAGE LETS THERE BETTER BARRELS DO THERE TALKING. iD BE WILLING TO BET IF YOU TOOK A GOOD SAVAGE BRREL CUT IT TO FIT ON A REMINGTON ACTION AN LEFT EVERY THING ELSE ALONE THE REMINGTOM WOULD GET BETTER. IMO ;)
I HAVE A AK IN 223 WITH A 26 INCH HEAVY VARMINT BARREL MADE FROM A SAVAGE TAKE OFF BARREL. IT HAS ATLEAST A 1/16 " OR MORE OF VERTICAL AN HORIZANTAL PLAY INTHE BOLT AN CARRIER AN YET IT WILL SHOOT 1/2 GROUPS. IN FACT IT IS DAMM NEAR AS GOOD AS THE BOLT ACTIONS THE BARREL COMES OFF OF. MY THEROY IS MY BOLT IS FLOATING VERY MUCH LIKE THE SAVAGE BOLT HEAD AN THE PERCISION CHAMBER AN AN BARREL ARE DOING THE WORK OF POSITIONG THE ROUND AN NOT LETTING THE BOLT AFFECT IT. IN OTHER WORDS TAKING THE ACTION OUT OF THE EQUATION. IMO YOU NEED TO GET DOWN INTO THE 1/4" MOA AREA BEFORE ACTION FLEX AN ALL THE OTHER BENCH REST STUFF MAKES A DIFFERANCE. STOCK BEDDING AN ALL THAT STUFF ARE A PRODUCT OF MAKING THE ACTION PART OF THE BARREL. IMO.
SORRY FOR THE LONG POST TO MUCH COFFEE
YEA A BOLT ACTION THREAD WOULD NOT BE A BAD IDEA. IT WOULD HAVE TO BE BETTER THAN THE UNUSED SAIGA THREAD AREA.
08-13-2012, 12:32 PM
also if you have a paid membership you have access to snipers hide videos in which they teach you how to read wind, track targets on the move, shoot from a raised platform, and even advanced rifle cleaning
KNOWING HOW TO SHOOT YOUR RIFLE IS MORE IMPORTANT THAN ANY OF THE DODADS AN OTHER TATICAL CRAP YOU CAN ADD ON. BUYING AMMO AN SHOOTING IT IS LIKEY MORE VALUABLE THAN A 3000 DOLLAR SCOPE OR SPECIAL STOCK. ITS SKILL NOT THE GUN IMO.
THE TRUE SNIPERS THAT DO IT FOR A LIVING GOULD LIKELY TAKE MY BOLT ACTION WINCHESTER M70 DERR RIFLE WITH A 4X WEAVER AN OUT DO 99% OF THE TATICOOL SNIPER RIFLE OWNERS IN ANY GIVEN SITUATION THEY LIKEY COULD DO IT WITH A MOSIN NAGANT . A TARGET RIFLE IS LIKE A RACE CAR IT TAKES A OPERATOR WHO NOWS WAHT HE IS DOING TO MAKE IT ANY GOOD.
LAST WEEK I SHOT TRAP GOT HIGH SCORE FOR THE NIGHT USING A $100 USED MOSBURGE 500. BEST SCORE i HAD ALL YEAR. MY $3000 TRAP GUN REALLY GIVES ME NO ADVANTAGE AN THE GUYS WITH THE $15,000 GUNS GOT JUST AS BEAT. ITS ABOUT PRACTICE PRACTICE PRACTICE. MOST HUNTING SHOTS ON DEER UNDER 400 YARDS HAVE LITTLE TO DO WITH HOW ACCURATE THE RIFEL IS AS LONG AS THE RIFEL IS DECENT TO BEGINE WITH . LOT OF GOOD HUNTERS SHOOTING REMINGTON 700,S THAT WONT SHOOT UNDER 1.5"S AT 100 YARDS WITH FACTROY AMMO. ( I WAS ONE FOR YEARS)
08-13-2012, 03:37 PM
i couldnt agree more with you 1biggun my forte is USPSA and i can tell you from experience whenever a new guy comes to shoot with us and asks what cool go fast goodies he should put on his brand new gun every single guy out there says ammo!! lots and lots of ammo then the trigger, then the sights, and after that its all tinkering because your bored lol. so imo $99 mosin nagant $200 worth of milsurp 7.62r can do more for your shooting than a $10,000 scope. so how about instead of a bolt action section for the few that want to build up a bolt action on an ak website how about a section dedicated to improving your shooting skill? geared more for drills (tueller, mosambique, etc.) and basic movements (pulling from concealment, holsters, transitions, reloads, basic draw stroke etc.) how to use a sling or certain kinds of stock. anyone down for this? im actually pretty stoked with my little brain storm there lofl ofcourse im geeky and have been known to practice my draw stroke and FTF drills while watching tv for a few hours.
08-13-2012, 04:20 PM
08-13-2012, 07:06 PM
I would not mind a bolt action area. some day im going to try to do a perfect mauser sporter when I got the time an money. there a beautiful gun when done right an a pos if done poorly.
Im always lookig for a perfect action to begine with.
i have a couple really nince 1919 argenteenes but here just two nice to destroy.
what is the best mauser action you can obtain??????
08-13-2012, 09:15 PM
You know I've never done a Mauser build but I have researched and Played around with the idea but from what I read and asked around the general consinces was Belgium receivers are of the higher quality of the Mauser actions
08-13-2012, 09:55 PM
1biggun, I agree with you about terminology and perception.
I will say, in my defense, that I put "sniper" in quotation marks because a lot of people like to refer to accurized rifles that way. And that's as wrong as calling anything with black furniture an "assault weapon". I think we have the media to thank for that.
Heck, a lot of plain-jane, bolt-action .22s are extremely accurate in the hands of an experienced shooter. That doesn't make them "sniper rifles"-- there was a time when a lot of people depended on them and their capabilities to put food on the table.
Any fool can hose down an area, and the law of averages says they're bound to hit something sooner or later. My hat's off to the guy who knows how to control his (or her) shots. In outdoor, open conditions; being able to shoot groups you can cover with a coin-- that's not a "sniper", that's a true marksman.
I've got a tube-feed Remington .22 that's been my plinker since I was in high school. Wouldn't trade it for the world. It's nothing to look at; but it's been on countless shooting expeditions with my brother. It's put enough tin cans to death to fill a dump. Turned enough paper targets into confetti to supply a good-sized parade. And it's MY .22
Regarding 700s. I like them 'cause I know them. I packed an M24 in my younger days
and have had a few BDLs as personal rifles. I don't doubt for a moment that there are 'better', less expensive/more expensive rifles and accessories out there; but for me... 700s just do the job they were designed to do.
08-18-2012, 12:23 AM
I used to build them on the vz 24 action but good luck finding one. Maybe at a gun show. I built a 458 win mag safari rifle on an Argentine 1909 and a 270 win on a Brazilian made by Orbendorf. Nowadays I just dont find many. what I liked about the vz 24 was that most had sewer pipe bbls so they were cheap, and I was swapping the bbls anyway.If yall find some let the folks here know.
08-21-2012, 08:52 AM
Built a .308 on an M98 action made by the Imperial German Amberg Arsenal in 1906.
08-23-2012, 11:25 AM
Decent acions are getting harder to find nowdays, back when I was comming up through it wasn't a big deal but now,,,, pretty tough to find good ones, or any for that matter. I got a Dr. apointment this afternoon but will put up some pics of the bolt guns I've built up later. The prettyist being the Mauser I just got from bellson last fall, damn good shooter too. Worst part is now there's hardley any place to shoot more than 100m any more for pratice around here.
I may have a Springfeild reciever, 03 I think, and a new barrel all in "the white" and a stock blank I might be putting up for sale soon, I can't decide if I'm going to use it or not, probibly not sense I don't have access to machineing any more to finish it up.
Would anyone here be interested in something like that? I'd just as soon sell it here as anywhere else at this point.
If there's an intrest I'll gather up everything and get some pics up later and figure out what to ask for it. Not sure what other trinket parts I may have for it but I'll check around to see what I have , if there's any intrest.