12GA FH--Hairy Shotgun/Rifle--

[hubel458]

First is picture sectioned Explora case and slug, showing how
they kept weight down so that it could be stepped up in
speed in older doubles, with just short rifling section at muzzle,
that didn't have real heavy barrels. Second picture from Greener
book here, is of older 4 and 8 gauges.

Third picture shows steps of making 4bore case, one inch bore,
from 20mm. 2nd in picture is case with base turned and swaged
to size which leaves base smaller than rim, for rimmed case.
Then 3rd case has top expanded to take 1" diameter slug.
last shows the thickness and strength of finished case.

Testing factory 20ga Hastings sabot slug 3.5" hotrod loads, and
reloaded with 20ga SPW identical slugs, 390gr, goes about 2200
from 30" heavy barrel. Load was 75gr of 4759.
Factory is about 1900. For regular modern barrels you could
do with 65 gr and get about 2000.Ed

[hcpookie]

Now that slug is a very interesting design! Looks like a lead base with a hollow copper ballistic tip. HRM... that has me thinking about possibilities for some sort of plastic tip! The modified Lee slug has me re-assessing the block of aluminum I have in the shop. I may hazard trying to make a new slug mold of my own. Oh the possibilities!

[Winn R]

Ed -- this may have been covered earlier and I missed it -- but are these 4 bore sizes covered as aow? Do they need a stamp or does that not apply here?

[hubel458]

I did similiar with RG's jkt, deep hollowpoint slug, using glue gun,
to fill nose and make point, and picture is in thread earlier.
And now BPI has light version HP.

As far as 4bore, 8bore etc and all shotgun calibers over 50cal
they are all, exempt from DD rules, as sporting use, as
per Title 19 GCA, Section 921. Under same section
all other rifle calibers over 50 are exempt if they are
designated sporting, by older one sgrandfathered in or
newer the developers applied to ATF and got Sporting
Exemption, like I did my 585s and 700s, and like many
others(JDJ,AHR,etc) have done.

Some info about our slower powder reloads in plastic and
brass cases with shotgun primers for modern 12ga guns.
I now prefer the IMR 4759 over 4227 as we have had
some delayed firing problems when the loaded cases get
real cold with 4227..And with slower powder loads use
magnum primers.

A side note,in same vein, you know I now use FED239
mag primers in my 8ga and 4ga, but we find they they really
solve the real cold gun, ignition problems, in muzzle loaders
using black powder substitutes, with shotgun primer
inline guns. We tested 50cal and a primer sold especially
for ML when fired,no powder, only saw a tip of the flame
out the barrel, a FED209 mag about 4" flame, buta Fed 239
Mag primer about a foot of flame.

Some more info from the old days, here is picture of
a variety of slugs being promoted and used a century ago.
And 2nd picture Paradox cases old and new.Bottom one is a
modern version sold by H&H for slug hunters.Ed

[Winn R]

Thank you Ed. I've just gotten one of the Cheq 26.5 shoulder mounted flare guns.

They have 1/4" thick steel walls at the chamber and that area is reinforced for 4". Bore is 1.04". Barrel length 20". Chrome lined barrel. There is no choke. It's built like an elephant gun.

I instantly thought of you although I've no idea if this gun will function in the large bore arena of your expertise.

I've ordered 26.5 cases primed with a 9mm cartridge (without the bullet). In addition I've ordered some .065" brass tubing and flat stock to see if I can tig or silver solder some cases together.

I have pryodex but have no idea what I'm doing.

[1biggun]

ANY ONE SEEN THIS .70 CAL RIFLE ????

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HOW IS THIS NOT ILLEAGLE AS ITS A RIFLE OVER .50 CAL?????????? 16" BARREL BTW. LOOKS LIKE A REALLY NICE BUILD.

THE AMMO LOOKS LIKE hUBLES WORK SORT OF. ONLY THER ENOT CALLING IT A SHOT GUN SHELL.

[TRX]

I've seen it. Nice build.

The builder may have gone the same route as Ed and others - just file the application with the ATF to approve the cartridge "for sporting purposes". So far, I haven't heard of them ever rejecting an application. Or he could have just copied some other cartridge that was already approved.

If you want to build something chambered in .700 Hubel Express, for example Ed's ATF approval covers you too, since the approval is for the cartridge, not the applicant.

[1biggun]

If you want to build something chambered in .700 Hubel Express, for example Ed's ATF approval covers you too, since the approval is for the cartridge, not the applicant.

hmmmmmmmm. HUBLES GUNS ARE SHOTGUNS UNLESS I MISSED SOMETHING??

WHAT IS THE CALIBUR/BORE IN INCHES OF A 12 GUAGE SHOT GUN?? I HAVE A IDEA IF THIS CAN BE DONE IN A RIFLE BARREL AND 16" LONG AS A RIFLE.

[TRX]

The "From Hell" cartridges are for shotguns. Ed has others like the 700HE that are ATF approved, or exempted, or whatever they call it.

[hcpookie]

Originally Posted by 1biggun

hmmmmmmmm. HUBLES GUNS ARE SHOTGUNS UNLESS I MISSED SOMETHING??

WHAT IS THE CALIBUR/BORE IN INCHES OF A 12 GUAGE SHOT GUN?? I HAVE A IDEA IF THIS CAN BE DONE IN A RIFLE BARREL AND 16" LONG AS A RIFLE.

The 12 GFH is a shotgun, yes.

12 gauge = .73" give or take.

16" I don't think so... this is something where shorter barrels aren't going to help. You'd burn up so much of the powder in muzzle blast that there really wouldn't be a point to it. You want a barrel long enough to burn enough of that powder to get that slug up to speed.