AR 15 Question..

[4thIDvet]

O.K so here is the question.
My buddy has about $1,200 to spend on a AR-15. Give or take on the $$$. He could spend more if he has too.
He would like to get one of those carbine SBR shooters.
If you could put your dream weapon together and work with that. What would you put together?
Fairly decent guy he is. When he ain't drunk. But he has not touched one in over 40 years.
Put your dream weapon together and give my buddy some advice guys please, too the rookie AR buddy of mine.
Any advice he would welcome.
Thank You. 4th.
P.S. I will pass all info provided to my buddy.

[tanvil]

4th, if he doesn't have any previous experience with them, let's assume he wants a complete rifle from the manufactuer.
If that's the case, I'd recommend he call Rich at Fulton Armory and order either a Liberator or a Phantom.
They are 16'' barrels not SBR's but they are damn nice.
My phantom was right around $1200. And the service that I get from that Marine is outstanding.

[555th]

After his $200 tax stamp, he's only going to have around a grand to spend, I would build a 14.5" SBRed M-4. J&T (DoubleStar) sells the kits and you can pick up one of their lowers for @ $100.

They are as good as any out there. I have had 4 of their recievers and and couple of their uppers with absolutely no complaints.

Here's a link to the M-4 kit:
[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]

Centerfire along with a lot of other places carry the lowers.

I think he could end up with a top shelf SBRed AR for @ $900

[j427x]

double-star makes some good stuff. they make a really nice 14.5 inch government profile with 1in7 twist rate.

a place that once built some very good AR-15/m4s for reasonable money was henderson defense out in Nevada. at one time before the panic they were selling some really nice rifles with 4150 barrels chrome lined for around $760. since the panic they may be charging more or OOS. if he is into high end stuff he could check out daniel defense, or saber. i would say call LMT but there still on BO i'll bet. search around on the net and see if you can locate a LMT SBR complete upper-- they were about $440 before the panic--you might find a few of the SBR's in a few places.be aware that bolts and hand-guards are extra for the lmt upper kit.

you should be able to build near the top of the line SBR/M4 for the $1200 and have some substantial change left over.

i think JSE surplus still has some 10.5 inch YHM barrles for $210--aim has a very nice m4 upper stripped for $79 shipped--add $24 for the fsb, $10.50 for the gas tube, $8.5 for the flash-hider and washer. add in hand guards bolt carrier and bolt, charging handle and you pretty much got the upper covered.--

only thing about the short barrels is that they are slightly more fickle than the 14.5s or 16s-- i don't build anything shorter than 11.5inches myself--but i have seen many a 10 inch and shorter that ran pretty well.

most of the barrels i am finding these days are 1-9 twist what twist rate does he want?

[pirate56]

get a rock river carbine, or a 11" ueper with an ace shorty stock if he wants an sbr, they shoot steel cased ammo with no problem, and they are acurate.

[555th]

Originally Posted by pirate56

get a rock river carbine, or a 11" ueper with an ace shorty stock if he wants an sbr, they shoot steel cased ammo with no problem, and they are acurate.

Can't go wrong with a Rock River, but I don't think it would be within a $1200 budget...and then there's the stamp.

[j427x]

how about a conversion like 7.62x39?

model one sales has a 11.5 inch 7.62x39 upper and kit! it would be wild blasting that flaming fireball maker!!!

i recently built a 16 inch 5.45x39 upper it is a blast to shoot and the ammo is not too expensive still-- the damn problem with the m-16/m4/CAR is there is so many ways you can build the black-leggo gun--

heck --M&A has some SBR uppers for $325 in 5.56

i looked around and bravo company has some LMT 10.5s as does mattD-tac. then high end stuff is running $475+ with no bolt or CH. but hell at least it is in stock at least.

all kinds of stuff for the SBR is out there. he just needs to decide on what he wants and what he wants to spend on it. if you shop around and BIY you should be able to finish up a nice one for well under the $1200 budget.

i would guess you could build a plain jane kit one for about $700 not counting mags and tax stamp. then buy $500-$300 in ammo and mags--LOL

[4thIDvet]

Cool. Keep em coming guys. Thanks.
1 in 7. 1 in 9 what the heck is the difference?
Think that shorty like pirate put up is along the lines of what he is looking for.
How hard are these things too build?
So once you FFL the lower the rest of the parts can just be ordered?

[555th]

Originally Posted by 4thIDvet

Cool. Keep em coming guys. Thanks.
1 in 7. 1 in 9 what the heck is the difference?
Think that shorty like pirate put up is along the lines of what he is looking for.
How hard are these things too build?
So once you FFL the lower the rest of the parts can just be ordered?

1 in 7, 1 in 9 are the twist rates of the barrel....depends on how heavy of a bullet you want to shoot.

Easy to build...snap right together.

The stripped lower receiver is the only thing that has to go through an ffl...everything else can be ordered and delivered to your house.

[j427x]

1 in 7 twist is for the longer bullets like 75g,77g and so fourth. it is the more current military issue. the 1in7 is generally not used with bullets weighing less than 55g. you mostly find the 1in7 twist made of the mill spc steel more often than not. all of our shorty weapons were 1-7 twist with the 4150CVA steel similar to the LMT.

the 1 in 9 twist is generally good up to about 75grains. the steel used in the 1-9 twist depends on the barrel maker some 1-9s are 4150 and most are 4140. this depends on the brand. about 80% of the barrels out there are 1-9 4140 steel. the 1-9 is considered the best all around/general purpose--but it is not the best with the longer bullets.

if you have built a few AKM's a AR-15/m4/CAR is a walk in the park. you can build one in an hour and that is one where the upper & barrel is not delivered assembled!!

does your pal want a "professional" grade or a more of a "plinker"?

the main things between the high dollar types and the less expensive is usually the barrel and bolt/BCG. back before all the military grade stuff got super-pricey i ran the military grade stuff exclusively.

since all the panic shortages i have bought some of the 4140 non chrome barrels and they seem to be up to the task. so less your buddy is a navy UDT on his way to the sand-pit the value of the 4150CVA chrome lined barrels is a toss up if it is worth the extra $$ or not. the 4140 non chrome i have been buying them for $150, chrome lined goes for about $200. the military stuff can go for as much as $360. those YHM barrels are a good barrel of the correct steel and chrome lined for $210--but you have to add FSB,barrel nut and so on to the price cause their stripped.

now bolts and BCG's all i have used till recently were LMT F/A type bolt &carriers--the standard types. i have lately started buying the m-16 de-branded types from m&a they are mixed up colts and FN. i still like the LMT's better--but de-branded ones seem to work as well. some places you can't have the m-16 bolt carrier check the local laws on it beforehand. don't get all exotic on bolts and bolt carrier groups. some of the more expensive types are to control pressure in suppressed types and they may cause problems in normal use.

on lowers--all uppers and lowers are interchangable. brands don't matter that much on lowers. as far as brand just buy what you like. mall-ninjas will say "franken-gun" but WTF do they know?--the mall ninja just called the weapon a GUN!--LOL

good mags make a huge impact on how any AR-type functions. the best mag i know of for the 5.56 round is the magpull P-mag. the D&H and C-products mags also work well any of these mags can be had for $14 to a low of about $9 a pop.

if i was really wanting a quality shortie upper i would likely buy a LMT 10.5 or the bravo company 11.5--their expensive $480 and bolts CH and handguards extra. that would add up to about $670 pick up one of those assembled lowers from JSE for about $270 and you got a high-quality shortie for $934 more or less +shipping. i personally would go with the 11.5barrel as that is closer to ideal on the dwell time. although if you want it as short as it can reliably get on a gas tube the 10.5 is the ticket.a regular no chrome lining 1-9twise shortie would be close to $750 i would guess.

now here is another thought and is more logical and practical. instead of the shorty get a 14.5inch M-4 profile add one of those phantom flash hiders--that will make it a full 16"-legal provided the FH is soldered or spot welded. save $200&paperwork+ get closer to the better dwell time on the gas system. a 16 middy would be the best overall. although others work. i have a 16 inch charles daily upper CDD m-4/carbine that runs like a champ--so there is some leverage on barrel/gas tube dwell time --you don't have to have any one combination it is just some are considered closer to ideal than others.


if your buddy is wanting the shortie--that is what he should get. the thing about these carbines--is there barrels down to 7.5 inches and up to 24+

you can do this a 1000 ways it just depends on wants and tastes mostly.

some guys spend $400 on rails and free-float hand-guards. i don't go this route. i keep mine more to the KISS system and stick with GI hand-guards and flat top uppers. i tend to go more for reliability than looks. i like the m-4 ramped uppers and barrel extensions although they are not a have to on the 5.56x45.

lately i have been building more cal-conversions than anything else.

another place i like to deal with is steve over at ADCO--last time i looked he had some colts over there for $1400 some people just love the colt more.

my preference is more to saber or LMT. but they are difficult to come by these days. i like to roll my own and only spend the $$ where it might actually count. i don't worry too much about impressing the mall-ninjas.