WTF is going on with people selling Saiga 12's???

Supply and Demand. Plain and simple. ATF created the demand by squeezing the Import numbers to start the demand curve, then issued several opinions early on in the Obama reign.

Mall Ninjas freaked out, and started buying them. Folks like us saw an opportunity to produce what the end customers really wanted, and added their mark-up to the price.

The simple fact is that we should actually be happy with this turn of events. There are more gun buyers now than at any time in the past 35 years according to the sales numbers published by the ATF (4473 applications, supported by NICS numbers).

More sales = more gun voters. Simple. We can not be easily ignored.

BTW. The Golani is the most underrated rifle ever. They have issues, but they are solvable. $399-499 is a GREAT price for that bit of Century Technology.

"You have to always find the bright side when you are King"....


Regards,

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Originally Posted by smartbomb

Wait till the guys at the local shop trys to sell a promag for $90. I choked and asked why. "Oh the atf is going to ban the 12" I called bs and he wasn't amused

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I know this tread is kinda old but I wanted to comment. Around this same time frame I went into a gunshop looking for a s-12 and the owner said they were gonna be banned. I had read all the info and learned that they were in fact not gonna be banned and told him as much. He knows it all of course and strongly disagreed. What is a person to do when the folks that are supposed to be knowledgeable about what they are selling refuse to educate themselves and rely solely on heresay and wild rumors? Not the first time this has happened and I figure it wont be the last.

md, same shit about 3 months ago in a LGS in St Augustine Fl. Saiga AGP's for my 410 at $106 each, and $89 at the gun show the following weekend. The only difference between then and the S12 fiasco, both dealers had adopted the "you dont want to pay this price...oh well, someone else will".

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Originally Posted by mtdew

I know this tread is kinda old but I wanted to comment. Around this same time frame I went into a gunshop looking for a s-12 and the owner said they were gonna be banned. I had read all the info and learned that they were in fact not gonna be banned and told him as much. He knows it all of course and strongly disagreed. What is a person to do when the folks that are supposed to be knowledgeable about what they are selling refuse to educate themselves and rely solely on heresay and wild rumors? Not the first time this has happened and I figure it wont be the last.

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I took a close and hard look at the IAC "870 Clone"....Here is a link:
IAC Hawk Pump Action Shotgun 12 Gauge 3" 18.5" Barrel, 5 Rounds, Synthetic Stock, Scope Rail, Matte Black

I was able to fit an 870 barrel without modification, and 870 furniture and mag extension without any real issues.

I want to be clear: I have NOT fired one of these. But my buddy has, and he swears by this very in-expensive shotgun. He also owns two 870's, a couple of Mossbergs, several really nice Skeet Guns, and a couple of 1100's as well. He is a Bird Hunter. He reloads. He is Mr. Scattergun. Oh, he also owns 3 Saigas.

His opinion is: Do not buy a $900 shotgun, unless you just want to look cool. Buy the $200 variety, and be sure to buy one for each family member. Really easy to train on, really easy to reload for, and really easy to maintain.

I have owned several Remingtons, several Mossbergs, and numerous Saigas. Not to mention the goochi guns....I really liked the Bennelli 590.... But in the end, I am an 870 fan-boy. I am planning on buying one of these el-cheapo chinese clones, and giving it a good run through in terms of inter-changability. So far, I think that spending a bunch of money on a Remington may just be a big waste of money. But, I will wait until I learn first-hand.

Just my $0.02.

Regards,

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Originally Posted by mtdew

I know this tread is kinda old but I wanted to comment. Around this same time frame I went into a gunshop looking for a s-12 and the owner said they were gonna be banned. I had read all the info and learned that they were in fact not gonna be banned and told him as much. He knows it all of course and strongly disagreed. What is a person to do when the folks that are supposed to be knowledgeable about what they are selling refuse to educate themselves and rely solely on heresay and wild rumors? Not the first time this has happened and I figure it wont be the last.

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Because a gun retailer has every incentive to perpetuate rumors that they are going to be banned, and no disincentive for doing this.

Indeed, and there's still a large body of information on the Interweb that perpetuates that rumor. The most interesting one I read was that the reason the S12 drums were allowed was that the ATF was busy doing other things and didn't want to add the S12 to "the DD list" at that time. Well I said "HUH?" like you just did. :) Apparently that is the reason being used to avoid converting S12 drums to other shotguns like the MKA1919 shotgun on a commercial/retail basis... custom one-off conversions notwithstanding. I'm still at a loss to understand where they got THEIR information... seems the rumor is there but nothing to substantiate it. No quotes, no references on sources, nothing. Just a comment from someone apparently "informed" of the inner workings of the ATF more than the average Interweb surfer.

I will make a GUESS that their disposition is that the S12 is still on the list to go on the chopping block "one day" to make people want to buy their non-S12 accessories. Again, just a guess on my part.

I know I can't believe what folks are paying. When I saw Sagia's selling for huge $$ , or any AK platform for that matter. I put up a cherry 308 16" barrel Sagia that I didn't honestly care for much with 3 mags ,scope and mount and just let the bidding commence,,, believe it or not it went down the road for $900 on the first go-round on Gun Broker,,,, Un- fugging real !!! I just put up what everyone else was putting up for a reserve at that time and it went for $100 more,,,,,,,,:dunno:

What ever,, who am I to judge,,, but honestly would any of you pay that for one????,,,,,,,,not me!! That day may come,, someday, when that might be a bargain,,, but not now,,, IMO. I can't honestly feel guilty sense it was an auction,,, after all! When Twinkies first went out they were getting hundreds apiece for them,,,?????,,,,,WTF is up with that, it's a friggin Twinkies ??????? Hundreds ???:dunno: I Don't get it :confused:

Human nature is a strange thing sometimes !!

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Originally Posted by hcpookie

I will make a GUESS that their disposition is that the S12 is still on the list to go on the chopping block "one day" to make people want to buy their non-S12 accessories. Again, just a guess on my part.

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Oh, I think it is pretty clear that the ATF wants to ban the Saiga... They just can't stretch the existing laws/regs far enough to do so, and getting any new legislation through congress is NOT gonna happen. The base sporter shotgun is entirely legal, and drum magazines are also entirely legal. Stretching the DD rules to cover modifications that are currently legal would be an unenforceable nightmare, particularly given the sheer number of shotguns in circulation, and the fact that the base components are, once again, totally legal. Hell, they don't even try to enforce 922r against individuals, and that's fairly well established. I'm sure the whole Saiga situation has got to just chap their asses.