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We've been expecting this, here we go again.


http://www.madison.com/wsj/home/opinion/index.php?ntid=18927&ntpid=0


OPINION


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Get this weapon out of the woods

[font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]11:50 pm 11/22/04
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You've probably heard this before: Guns don't kill people. People kill people.

We're in lockstep with that premise. Nevertheless, we can't deny that a military weapon with rapid-fire capability sure makes it easy for people to kill lots of other people quickly, whether those victims are on the battlefield, urban streets, outside the White House or in the Wisconsin woods.

Those are all locations where gunmen wielding cheap, easily obtained SKS semiautomatic rifles have sprayed bullets at people and buildings. This weapon was used this week to kill five hunters and wound three others, one who died Monday, over just a few minutes in the woods of northwestern Wisconsin.

The SKS is not an assault rifle in the textbook sense, and it's not very high- powered compared to typical deer rifles. It is less accurate and deadly than, say, the Wisconsin hunter's trusty .30-30. Though the SKS is popular because of its low cost, humane hunters who want to kill game cleanly and quickly tend to choose weapons other than the SKS.

In fact, this gun is not a sporting weapon at all; it was conceived and first built a half-century ago as a tool to kill people, and too often, that's how it is still used today. The SKS may not be in the same firepower league as the notorious AK-47, but it is easily modified into an illegal high-capacity fully automatic.

Even in its original semiautomatic mode, the gun is an apparent favorite of cop killers and wackos. SKS rifles have been used to kill at least five police officers this year. At least eight other officers have been killed by SKS-wielding gunmen since 1998. The guy who sprayed the White House with bullets 10 years ago used the SKS.

Gun rights advocates are correct that gun restrictions alone won't solve the problem of gun violence. But limited bans on the sale and import of certain weapons do address the problem by degree, without overturning Second Amendment rights to bear arms. More stringent laws will make it harder to get these especially lethal weapons as easily.

At a bare minimum, Wisconsin should restrict the magazine capacity of these guns: How many bullets are needed to kill an animal? Even better, banning the sale and import of the foreign-made SKS and similar guns wouldn't curtail ownership of the many other more effective hunting guns. It's true that some sporting weapons are semiautomatics, but not all semiautomatics are sporting weapons.

In fact, until this September, many types of semiautomatic guns were banned under a 10-year-old federal law. The ban should be revived - and extended to cover modified and after- market weapons designed to skirt the 1994 law.

Widespread gun ownership is a fact of life in the United States. Americans already own an estimated 100 million guns of all types. Banning sale or import of one type of weapon because of its established role in murder and mayhem doesn't infringe on Second Amendment rights, nor will it in any way diminish Wisconsin's deer hunting traditions. In fact, hunters might find a return to more sporting rifles - the traditional bolt-action deer gun that gives a hunter one clean and powerful shot at a time -improves their hunt.

People kill people, but some guns make murder too easy. The killings in northern Wisconsin suggest that the federal ban on some semiautomatics should be reinstated - and broadened - to protect both the public and police.






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It sure is!

We could point out the flaws and bias in the editorial, and still be labeled "gun nuts" by those who feed on such drivel.

Obviously it's the firearm at fault, not the (and I quote): the mentallity of the "cop killer or wacko".

:angry:

quick edit: I just watched the CBS take on the story. As they show the mug shot of the 36 year old Vietnamese immigrant they super-imposed the "Chinese SKS assault weapon" (not unlike the way they do NFL football graphics--it grows from a speck on the screen to a full screenshot), and I quote "that holds 20 rounds". The picture was your garden variety 10 round SKS (to be honest I expected a picture of a Yugo but it did indeed resemble a Chicom).

Focus on the crime and the people involved? Naaa, it's the gun. That bad, bad "assault rifle".
 

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Yeah... they're prbably right.... no way he coulda done the deed with, say.... a Browning BAR in 270, or even a Remington model 700 in 30-06... well, maybe he could have, but according to these "experts" I guess they'd be less dead, speaking in terms of deadness, that is....
I'll have to change my screen name...
 

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sks_hunter said:
I'll have to change my screen name...
Might wanna ditch that Maine-iac line too!:biggrin:

Man, it doesn't take long for people to find a scapegoat. It's actually sad those folks have given up on the concept of being prepared to arm themselves against a tyrannical government. What's worse is when the media has to explain what a deer stand is to the city dwelling sheeple. There's probably a whole lot more to this Wisconsin masscre than we'll ever hear. Too bad no one in th media/public is going to look there, their idea of prevention is set in removing what they feel to be the threat (obviously the gun). CBS yet again focused on the rifle's 20 round capacity. Makes for an easy scapegoat since Bill Clinton signed his 10 round ban into law...
 

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It amazes me that the anti gun writers all come out aa soon as something like this happens. They don't care about the results of the investigation, motive, ect. They show their hand early, take away everyones' second amendment rights, and the problem goes away.
 

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Preacher said:
...easily obtained SKS semiautomatic rifles have sprayed bullets at people and buildings...

...The guy who sprayed the White House with bullets 10 years ago used the SKS....
Even though this asshat admits that the rifle is a semi and not a full auto, it is still portrayed as a bullet hose.

Funny, My SKS does not fire any quicker than My Remington 742 Woodsmaster, or any of my other semi's for that matter.

But we wouldn't want the facts to get in the way of a good story.
 

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Damn, this really makes me upset and sick at the same time. Friggin mental Anti gun asshats are haveing a field day with this. They do not give two shits about the people involved or the facts, just the frigging inaniment(sp?) tool. :censored2

I just wonder if the murderer was caught poaching by the hunters? Also the way he shot eight people makes me believe he didnt have his magazine capacity restricted to 5 rounds for hunting. If he did I would think that someone at least could have returned fire while he was reloading. :confused:

I think I need a hug :bawling:
 

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Hopefully the knee jerk reaction bunch has lost it's grip on the general populace. They are still going to try to use incidents like these to ban guns, but the public has much better access to the truth these days.

The fact that Kerry was not able to hoodwink a majority of the folks speaks volumes, and I don't think the anti's are gonna be able to stampede the masses anymore. I hope! GG
 

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interesting, sounds similiar to the opinions spouted by former Montgomery, AL Chief of Police (John Wilson). The SKS is just so evil (NOT!!! :D :D ).
 

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From what I hear from friends in the area. He could have done it with a single shot NEF. He was shooting unarmed people. dressed in blaze orange, who were trying to help the woundeed. No evidence that the one person with a weapon ever even tried to return fire.

And he was shooting at under 100 yards.
 

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Dissenting opinion:

I happen to think that rigid gun control would, in fact, result in fewer firearms-caused deaths in the United States. I also happen to think that it doesn't matter.

Because it isn't just soldiers who die for freedom.

The trade-off between safety and freedom occurs in a number of arenas. Gun laws are just one of them.
 

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Cephus said:
You are kidding right , and if not please explan how a gun law is going to stop a crime. Now I don't mean to down play the ones that are out there now but none of them have helped to stop one crime that I know of. They have pervented a felon from purchaceing one but as far as I know that's it. :thumbup1: :thankyou:
Here's an example, and I'm suprised that Michael Moore missed it: In Bowling for Columbine Moore compares the USA with Canada, notes that the former has a much higher gun-related homicide rate than the latter. Moore ascribes it to the inherently violent American character.

What Moore missed is that Canada has very stringent gun control.

Anyway, guns and drugs are similar in that easy access to either means increased potential for negative consequences, for folks to have them who probably shouldn't.

But please do not misunderstand me: I am opposed to gun control.

We would be safer if the American populace were disarmed, though. We would be safer if all Americans were subject to random drug tests. We would be safer with government monitoring of all communications, whether via the internet, mail, or telephone; eavesdropping stations in public areas may be a good idea. We certainly would be safer with constant video monitoring of the activities of all citizens.

Safety just ain't worth the price.
 

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Dzerzhinsky said:
Dissenting opinion:

I happen to think that rigid gun control would, in fact, result in fewer firearms-caused deaths in the United States. I also happen to think that it doesn't matter.

Because it isn't just soldiers who die for freedom.

The trade-off between safety and freedom occurs in a number of arenas. Gun laws are just one of them.
This is almost an absolute truth.

However, when the freedom to bear arms is sacrificed, security is not one of the usual results. How many people died in Armenia after surrendering their arms to the Turks upon a promise of peace? How many Jews died as a result of Germany's gun laws? Currently, violent crime rates are rising in Great Britain, an Anglo model for gun control, and Washington DC, the murder capital, has been an American example.

... but, I really like the following statement:

"Because it isn't just soldiers who die for freedom."

That is eloquent and so very true.
 

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I figured it wouldn't take long for the antis to jump on the shootings. It would have been the same with an SKS, a lever action Winchester, or a bolt action rifle. They don't care, it just something to use against gunowners. The anti-gun people are going to use it to their advantage and this time it just happened to be an SKS. Their minds are made up, don't confuse them with the facts.
 

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Nicely put Strange Destiny, they have an agenda and that is all that matters to them.

Bring up the estimated 2 million (and to sound like a talking head, "yes folks that is with an M") violent crimes PREVENTED by folks who own/carry guns and they don't seem to have any "facts" on that. Blood sucking bastards, if there really is a God or Truth or Reason to our being those liars will burn/freeze for eternity in what we like to call Hell. GG
 

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Strange Destiny said:
I figured it wouldn't take long for the antis to jump on the shootings. It would have been the same with an SKS, a lever action Winchester, or a bolt action rifle. They don't care, it just something to use against gunowners. The anti-gun people are going to use it to their advantage and this time it just happened to be an SKS. Their minds are made up, don't confuse them with the facts.
For sure, remember how Chuck Connors could fire 11 shots in less than 2 1/2 seconds with his Winchester 92 on the old TV series, The Rifleman? I think this instance will make hunters approach trespassers differently. I still have serious doubts as to whether the Vietnamese guy was hunting deer. I suspect he was hunting men, and all his talk about racial animosity makes me think he was hunting men of another race than him.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Cephus said:
It sounds commie to me that we should be subject to such infringments on our
RIGHTS But thats just MHO
Ditto Cephus.
 
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